Govt crackdown on Airbnb, declares bookings illegal

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STEVE G
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Re: Govt crackdown on Airbnb, declares bookings illegal

Post by STEVE G » Sat May 19, 2018 7:32 pm

caller wrote:
Sat May 19, 2018 4:42 pm
fft100 wrote:
Sat May 19, 2018 1:52 pm
Whilst only condos have been mentioned so far, I wonder if this also applies to houses. If it does apply to houses, this could be the way to close down party houses, which would be a good result.
Well, where I live, the developments rules understandably comply with the law of the land, so short term lets under ? days are simply not allowed.
Where I live, out in Hin Lek Fai, many local Thai's are now building pool villas and renting them out daily and they're not complying with the law of the land, perhaps understandably considering the profits to be made! Generally they're not a problem, just family groups out for the weekend but sometimes you get huge groups of teenagers taking these places over for parties and that's when the problems start.

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Re: Govt crackdown on Airbnb, declares bookings illegal

Post by caller » Sat May 19, 2018 10:02 pm

STEVE G wrote:
Sat May 19, 2018 7:32 pm
Where I live, out in Hin Lek Fai, many local Thai's are now building pool villas and renting them out daily and they're not complying with the law of the land, perhaps understandably considering the profits to be made! Generally they're not a problem, just family groups out for the weekend but sometimes you get huge groups of teenagers taking these places over for parties and that's when the problems start.
I think I mentioned before that we had a landlord doing short term lets and although I never knew who or where it was, it reached the stage that we were all notified by email from the jurisitic office, that if the problem continued, security would be instructed to not allow access to the development to those he was renting to.
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Re: Govt crackdown on Airbnb, declares bookings illegal

Post by HHTel » Sat May 19, 2018 11:06 pm

fft100 wrote:
Sat May 19, 2018 1:52 pm
The main ruling applies to short term rentals, regardless of whether it is BNB or someone else.

Whilst only condos have been mentioned so far, I wonder if this also applies to houses. If it does apply to houses, this could be the way to close down party houses, which would be a good result.
Illegal hotels include serviced apartments, guest houses, condominiums, and other private properties available for rent for tourists.
I think the above covers pretty much all properties.

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Re: Govt crackdown on Airbnb, declares bookings illegal

Post by Takiap » Sun May 20, 2018 6:04 am

Okay, if a husband and wife are coming on holiday with their three kids, aged 5, 7 and 9, what are their options as far as hotel accommodation is concerned? Do they all cram into one large room, where Mom and Dad are then unable to share any "romantic" moments, or do they rent two rooms which essentially separates the family completely?

Alternatively, would it not be better to rent a private villa with pool where Mom and Dad have their room and the kids have theirs, and of course, considerably cheaper as well?



As for things like accident cover......hahaha, what a joke. If you are injured in a hotel in Thailand, do you honestly believe the hotel is going to pay out? Yeah sure, maybe a few baht at best. This ain't Europe.


If the hotels can't compete with Airbnb, then perhaps they need to change their business model. Maybe I am missing something, but sometimes it would be nice to see the authorities on the side of consumers instead of always backing big corporations.
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Re: Govt crackdown on Airbnb, declares bookings illegal

Post by 404cameljockey » Sun May 20, 2018 7:19 am

STEVE G wrote:
Sat May 19, 2018 7:32 pm
caller wrote:
Sat May 19, 2018 4:42 pm
fft100 wrote:
Sat May 19, 2018 1:52 pm
Whilst only condos have been mentioned so far, I wonder if this also applies to houses. If it does apply to houses, this could be the way to close down party houses, which would be a good result.
Well, where I live, the developments rules understandably comply with the law of the land, so short term lets under ? days are simply not allowed.
Where I live, out in Hin Lek Fai, many local Thai's are now building pool villas and renting them out daily and they're not complying with the law of the land, perhaps understandably considering the profits to be made! Generally they're not a problem, just family groups out for the weekend but sometimes you get huge groups of teenagers taking these places over for parties and that's when the problems start.
The Bankok Post editorial comment yesterday about the ruling and even mentioning Hua Hin did not mention this downside to letting by the day. Is it something that's widely known outside of HH also?

I lived next to a 'party house' for a few weeks in a mostly Thai-owned development. Crowds of teens/early 20s every weekend, but in fact they were always fairly peaceful.

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Re: Govt crackdown on Airbnb, declares bookings illegal

Post by buksida » Sun May 20, 2018 9:04 am

I don't for a moment think the junta have the people's interests in mind with this latest crackdown, they don't give a hoot about party houses or how much of a menace they can be.

Airbnb - a private company out of Thailand's control - takes 3% commission on bookings. The govt taxes the hell out of hotels and resorts in country, (well those with the official licenses anyway) - they're losing money and they want their cut, simple as that. As usual with this 'govt', its about filling their coffers, not whats better for the people.
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Re: Govt crackdown on Airbnb, declares bookings illegal

Post by 404cameljockey » Sun May 20, 2018 2:22 pm

buksida wrote:
Sun May 20, 2018 9:04 am
As usual with this 'govt', its about filling their coffers, not whats better for the people.
Really doesn't only apply to LOS though. The West taxes the hell out of alcohol and tobacco 'for our health'.

The main difference is the desire in the military mind of a high level of population control. The scheme to register farang's mobile phones is another good one. They want to know where you are and what you're doing. Oops, forgot that the UK has the highest level of CCTV coverage in the world, apparently! :)

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Re: Govt crackdown on Airbnb, declares bookings illegal

Post by crazy88 » Sun May 20, 2018 8:05 pm

Just a couple of articles I found that may be of interest on this subject.

Crazy 88

Quick disclaimer before I get into this: do not treat this as legal advice, this is a simple explanation of the various laws that you need to be aware of if you are looking to rent out a property short term or through AirBnB in Thailand. AirBnB and the law in Thailand have some conflicts but like all new industries, the legal framework isn’t setup to deal with it.

You are looking to rent out your property on AirBnB in Thailand? You want to make some extra money during your time when you are not in the area, you might be working abroad or taking an extended trip back to Europe / US or wherever. It is important to know how AirBnB and the law in Thailand work so that you can stay on the right side of things. Sites like AirBnB have brought short term rentals into the popular domain. More and more people are choosing to stay in short term rentals but what does the law say?

The Hotel Act
There is often confusion as to whether the hotel act applies to short term rentals. A lot of people see short term rentals as illegally operated hotels which need to go through the same regulations as a normal hotel. There is wording in the hotel act in Thailand that it only applies if you have 4 or more units in the same building. This means that if you are running your own unit on AirBnB or similar sites when you are out of town and not running multiple units then you do not need to worry about the regulation that is covered by the hotel act. You are not 4 units, therefore you are not covered by the act. That is the end of it.

Sometimes a juristic office will put up signs saying that the condo isn’t a hotel and that short term rental guests shouldn’t be there and it is not allowed. They are technically wrong if they are quoting the hotel act as a reason for justifying this. There are ways that a juristic office can justify their signs which try and frighten potential guests but using the hotel act if you are not operating more than 4 units in the building is not one of them.

The Condo Act
When you buy a condominium in Thailand, you are often given a fancy looking box which has everything to do with the condo in it. It will usually contain the keys for the room, mailbox, doors, windows and everywhere. Cards for access to the building and car park, perhaps a stamp for visitors you know who use the car park and some books. One of these books is a book of ownership and the other tends to be the condominium rules. These tend to focus on what happens if you make damage to the building or what to do in various scenarios. It is a way for the condominium to run peacefully and for all residents to get along.

The book is mainly written purely in Thai so if you do want to read it, then it is worth investing in a proper translation so you can see exactly what is written. If there is no mention of short term rentals in these rules then short term rentals have not been outlawed in the building. It is pretty much as simple as that. For new rules to be added, a general meeting needs to be called and a new rule needs to be proposed. If a rule is proposed then there is a vote from the remaining owners within the building. If the vote gets more than a 50% majority then it becomes a rule.

The Condo Act pretty much states that if something becomes a rule in the condo, it is covered by the law. Therefore condo rules are laws. If a condo majority of owners does decide that they do not want short term rentals in their building and it is voted that way then it would be illegal to run short term rentals in that building. If no such thing has happened, then the rule does not exist. If you are considering a property on the second hand market to run as a short term rental investment, ask for a copy of the condo rules. If you do your research, you have nothing to fear.


Is Your House or Condo in Thailand An Illegal Hotel?
4 Replies
Recently local authorities have promised to “crack-down” on illegal hotels. If you are a homeowner in Thailand you may think this is not a concern of yours. However, if you are renting your house or condo out – or if you are using a company to own it and are staying it yourself – this does indeed concern you. Local authorities are empowered under two laws to regulate and tax you in such cases: 1) the Hotel Act; and 2) the House and Land Tax Act.

Hotel Act

The Hotel Act (2008) requires any place that provides accommodation for less than a period of one month in exchange for payment is defined as a “Hotel”, regulated by the Hotel Act, and requires a hotel license.

There is a limited exception to this if:

1) the said place has less than five rooms; and

2) cannot accommodate over twenty guests at a time; and

3) the income being earned for such is merely “additional income”,

a license is not required. However, even in that case the owner must report to such accommodation activity to the relevant local authorities.

Anyone who operates Hotel without a license is liable for:

a) a fine of up to THB 20,000; plus

b) a fine of up to THB 10,000 per day of such illicit operation; and

c) imprisonment for up to one year (in the case of a company the person subject to such imprisonment would be director).

Conclusion – AirBnB and the law in Thailand
Rules in Thailand are pretty fluid and open to interpretation. If you are considering running a short term rental in the country then it is worth keeping an eye on the news and also what is happening in the country. Things can change quickly but if you look at the laws which affect short term rentals, then renting out an individual condo for a period of time shouldn’t be a problem. If you have 4 or more in the same building then you will start to have some headaches, just like if your building has voted to outlaw it.


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Re: Govt crackdown on Airbnb, declares bookings illegal

Post by Nereus » Mon May 21, 2018 9:56 pm

The relevant part is at the following:

https://thethaiger.com/lifestyle/proper ... -read-this
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Re: Govt crackdown on Airbnb, declares bookings illegal

Post by buksida » Wed May 23, 2018 10:20 am

Short-term leasing in condominium: Getting it right

Following the recent court rulings handed down to a condominium unit owner in Hua Hin, two of many questions arise: Why is it illegal to rent out condominium units on a short-term basis? Why has Thailand made condominium unit short-term leasing illegal?

A straightforward answer to the first question would be that the Thai law does not allow owners of condominiums to rent out their units for anything less than 30 days without a hotel operating licence.

An answer to the second question is no less simple: hotels offer short-term leasing as they have the correct operating licences and have also complied with all regulatory construction and safety guidelines required by law.

Condominiums, on the other hand, have been constructed and registered as residential properties under a shared ownership/juristic entity and subsequently sold as such.

The enforcement of the law in some cases had been a little slow to implement but now it is obviously speeding up, with the aforementioned court rulings that also draw closer attention from condominium juristic persons and co-owners.

To prevent co-owners from putting up units for rent on a short-term basis within a condominium, which does not have a hotel licence, owner committees and juristic managers have implemented various strategies -- from signage in lobbies stating "this is not a hotel" to notices to co-owners suspected of providing short-term rentals.

Rules and regulations have been reviewed and amended to underline that rental practices could be against the law.


https://www.bangkokpost.com/business/ne ... g-it-right
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Re: Govt crackdown on Airbnb, declares bookings illegal

Post by handdrummer » Thu May 24, 2018 2:19 am

"Could be against the law." It is or it isn't or is the law ambiguous?

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Re: Govt crackdown on Airbnb, declares bookings illegal

Post by Mandy with cats » Wed Jun 13, 2018 2:35 pm

https://www.interactivethailand.com/cor ... l-license/

Note: Residential buildings do not need to apply for a hotel license if there are only four rooms and less than 20 customers. The officer has to be informed thereof, and will go to check the place to classify it

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Re: Govt crackdown on Airbnb, declares bookings illegal

Post by Mandy with cats » Wed Jun 13, 2018 2:39 pm

the reason why airbnb in a condon is illegal because there are more than four owners rent out their units for short terms. If you are renting out a house, even it is in a development/ village, with four rooms under, no hotel license required. Lawyer told me that the four rooms count per deed. however, please correct me if i m wrong.

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Re: Govt crackdown on Airbnb, declares bookings illegal

Post by crazy88 » Sat Jun 16, 2018 8:49 pm

From Expedia who are pretty major players.

Crazy 88

READ ALL THE WAY DOWN


  ในช่วงไม่กี่อาทิตย์ที่ผ่านมา หลายๆโรงแรมในจังหวัดท่องเที่ยวหลักๆ เช่น
> เชียงใหม่และกระบี่ ได้รับการเข้าตรวจสอบใบอนุญาติโรงแรม
> ซึ่งทำให้หลายๆโรงแรมต้องปิดการขายไป หากคุณเป็นหนึ่งในโรงแรมที่อาจต้องได้รั
> บการตรวจและปิดการขาย คุณสามารถอ่านรายละเอียดข้างล่
> างเพื่อเข้าใจขั้นตอนการจัดการกับสถานการณ์ได้เลยค่ะ
> เราขอความร่วมมือให้คุณอัพเดตข้อมูลเพื่อเราจะได้ดำเนินการรั
> บมืออย่างถูกต้องค่ะ

    READ ALL THIS ONE WELL
>
> Recently, we have heard about how hotels in top tourist destinations, such
> as Chiang Mai and Krabi, have been visited by authorities for a hotel
> license check. This led to many hotels having to close down their
> businesses for an uncertain period of time. To make sure we take necessary
> actions, please update your hotel license status in the link below. If
> you're one of the hotels at risk, please refer to the steps below as a
> checklist your required actions.
>
> อัพเดตสถานะที่นี่ | Please
> update
>
> here
>
>
>
>
>
> สิ่งที่ต้องทำหากโรงแรมต้องปิดชั่วคราวเพราะไม่มีใบอนุญาต | What to do
> next if you have to close down because this?
>
>
> *Step 1*
>
> ปิดห้องในระบบ Partner Central หรือติดต่อเอ็กซ์พีเดียเพื่อแจ้งปิดการขาย
>
> Close-out your rooms on Partner Central or contact Expedia to stop sold
> *Step 2*
>
> เช็คในระบบว่ามีการจองที่ลูกค้ายังไม่เข้าพักหรือไม่
> ติดต่อเอ็กซ์พีเดียหากคุณไม่สามารถรับลูกค้าได้ คลิกที่นี่
>
> เพื่อเช็ค
>
> Check if you have future bookings. Contact Expedia if you cannot honor
> those bookings. Click here
>
> to check.
> *Step 3*
>
> ติดต่อเอ็กซ์พีเดียเมื่อพร้อมเปิดการขาย
>
> Reach out to Expedia once you're ready to re-open the property for
> bookings
>
>




To: assistanceth@expedia.com
Subject: Re: Please Update Your Hotel's License Status
กรุณาอัพเดตข้อมูลเกี่ยวกับใบอนุญาตโรงแรม

MY QUESTIONS. READ WELL



Hello

I list with you. Not hotel rooms or guesthouse or condominiums. Just
private, standalone villas with a max of 3 rooms and max 6 people.
Sometimes my bookings are for 3-14 days. Sometimes Thai nationals;
Sometimes foreigners or a mixture. We are a company and pay all our
required income taxes as advised by our lawyer and accountant . We are NOT
a hotel, condo, or guesthouse. Where do we stand?

Best regards

Steve

THE RESPONSE FROM EXPEDIA . A MAJOR WORLDWIDE AGENCY

Hello Steve,

Thanks for your promptly feedback.
This email is to raise awareness in case of some hotel got the issue.

!!!!!!!! In your case, there is no action required from you now.!!!!!!!

We appreciate for your explanation.

Regards,
Expedia Thailand Lodging Team,

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