Ceiling/roof insulation

Ask here about the pleasures and pitfalls of buying, selling or renting property and real estate in Hua Hin. Building, design and construction topics welcome. Commercial or promotional posts for real estate companies or private properties are forbidden.
SPONSORS: Hua Hin Property
User avatar
Jaime
Legend
Legend
Posts: 2372
Joined: Wed Jan 14, 2004 4:57 am
Location: At the coal face

Post by Jaime » Tue Jan 19, 2010 6:53 pm

Access to the roof will be required no matter which option is selected!
"The man who never made a mistake never did bugger all" - Old Welsh proverb

"Why limit yourself to the death of a crummy celery stalk when you can eat a giraffe?" - PWEETA

nevets
Guru
Guru
Posts: 636
Joined: Tue Apr 03, 2007 8:30 pm

Post by nevets » Tue Jan 19, 2010 7:03 pm

I would have thought an inspection hatch big enough for a person to go through when built would be essential. I have one in the ensuite to one of the bedrooms.

User avatar
prcscct
Hero
Hero
Posts: 19474
Joined: Tue Mar 23, 2004 7:58 am
Location: All Blacks training camp

Post by prcscct » Wed Jan 20, 2010 4:35 am

nevets wrote:I would have thought an inspection hatch big enough for a person to go through when built would be essential. I have one in the ensuite to one of the bedrooms.
Yes, we all have those I think. My thinking was the foam hose is hooked up to some kind of tank truck. The hose has to be quite long and woven up through your windows/rooms and into the attic hatch. Much easier when the house is under construction and you can pull the entire truck almost into the house. Pete :cheers:
Just 8 days of global military spending could fund 12 years of free, quality education for every child on the planet

User avatar
JimmyGreaves
Legend
Legend
Posts: 2852
Joined: Mon Oct 17, 2005 5:06 am
Location: HuaEireHin

Post by JimmyGreaves » Wed Jan 20, 2010 8:16 am

So is the idea of this the following:

1. The foil under the roof tiles reflects the sun off the roof thus keeping the roof space temperature down

2. The fibreglass that is to be laid on top of the plasterboard ceiling is there to hold any cold air in from aircon units?

I would have thought the fibreglass would also stop the heat rising and hold it in the room if the aircon was not being used, thus making it hotter. Also most roof spaces at least have some airflow space even if it is only where the bird/animal plastic stoppers go at the eaves
Diplomacy is the ability to tell a man to go to hell so that he looks forward to making the trip

User avatar
Nereus
Addict
Addict
Posts: 5602
Joined: Tue Jan 02, 2007 3:01 pm
Location: Hua Hin and Bangkok

Post by Nereus » Wed Jan 20, 2010 9:25 am

JimmyGreaves wrote:So is the idea of this the following:

1. The foil under the roof tiles reflects the sun off the roof thus keeping the roof space temperature down

2. The fibreglass that is to be laid on top of the plasterboard ceiling is there to hold any cold air in from aircon units?

I would have thought the fibreglass would also stop the heat rising and hold it in the room if the aircon was not being used, thus making it hotter. Also most roof spaces at least have some airflow space even if it is only where the bird/animal plastic stoppers go at the eaves
There is no simple answer, as there are too many variables involved. In a building in Thailand we are mostly concerned with "radiated" heat from the sun, as there are basically three types of heat transfer, radiation, convection and conduction.

Most of this radiated heat enters through the roof, as that is the most exposed area to direct sunlight. The material used to construct the roof has a big bearing on how much heat, and what type of "heat transfer" takes place, some will be by conduction, but mostly by radiation transfer.
Some heat will come through the walls, but the amount will also be affected by the type of construction, exposure to direct sunlight, etc.

So, yes, the reflective foil under the tiles is a very good start, as it tends to deflect the direct radiation, but not all of it, and it also conducts to a certain degree, so some heat will pass through, which heats up the ceiling space.

The fibre laid on top of the plasterboard consists of a multitude of tiny air cells which block both radiation and conduction. And it works in both directions, therefore helping to retain the cooler air conditioned side as well as blocking the hot side. Bear in mind that heat always travels from a hotter part of any material to a cooler part, always!

There is a lot of good information on the Internet, but just remember that it is a complex subject, and therefore can be a bit daunting trying to establish a clear picture. :cheers:
May you be in heaven half an hour before the devil know`s you`re dead!

nevets
Guru
Guru
Posts: 636
Joined: Tue Apr 03, 2007 8:30 pm

Post by nevets » Wed Jan 20, 2010 9:50 am

Pete , you are right long hoses would be needed to do the job after construction .
I have a modern design home but when it was built they didn't have insulation like today , and everything came from Bangkok not like today there is a home shop on every corner. :)

User avatar
Khundon1975
Rock Star
Rock Star
Posts: 3301
Joined: Wed Jan 14, 2009 4:05 am
Location: Boo, I'm behind you.

Post by Khundon1975 » Wed Jan 20, 2010 8:52 pm

prcscct :D

I would imagine that for small houses, as opposed to larger commercial buildings, the equipment needed would be a lot smaller.
Maybe a small compact wheeled compressor, with shorter hoses etc.

The foam is made up of two low viscosity liquids, an isocyanate and a resin, which are mixed at the spray head. As this mixed foam expands to 30 times the volume and attains around 90% closed cell volume, then the amount of raw materials needed for a house would be small, a couple of 25 Lt drums would do the trick. No need for a huge lorry in the lounge.:wink:

We had may dads house done a few years ago and we opted for the maximum density blend, which gave a weight of 60Kg per M3.
Translated into a thickness of around 25mm M2 that would be about 2kg per M2, so the added weight to a roof would be negligible.

The only problem with a roof that has been fitted with a reflective foil, is that it may have to be removed, (they removed the felt sheeting in my dads roof) in order for the foam to stick to the underside of the tiles or cement sheeting. Not sure on that though.
I wonder if the Thai companies use CFC liquids now, as they would be virtually fume free.?

:cheers:
I've lost my mind and I am making no effort to find it.

User avatar
prcscct
Hero
Hero
Posts: 19474
Joined: Tue Mar 23, 2004 7:58 am
Location: All Blacks training camp

Post by prcscct » Thu Jan 21, 2010 8:37 am

Yes, the photo on the below link looks as if indeed the chemicals are mixed at the spray head. This company is based in Pattaya but has offices in Bangkok and Issan. Pete :cheers:

http://www.lohr-trade.com/
Just 8 days of global military spending could fund 12 years of free, quality education for every child on the planet

nevets
Guru
Guru
Posts: 636
Joined: Tue Apr 03, 2007 8:30 pm

Post by nevets » Thu Jan 21, 2010 1:32 pm

Contacted them but they did not want to come to Phetchaburi. :(

User avatar
Jaime
Legend
Legend
Posts: 2372
Joined: Wed Jan 14, 2004 4:57 am
Location: At the coal face

Post by Jaime » Thu Jan 21, 2010 6:12 pm

There's definitely a firm doing it in Hua Hin because I have a flyer in my bedside cabinet drawer - can't give you the details I'm afraid because I'm not there at the moment!
"The man who never made a mistake never did bugger all" - Old Welsh proverb

"Why limit yourself to the death of a crummy celery stalk when you can eat a giraffe?" - PWEETA

User avatar
Khundon1975
Rock Star
Rock Star
Posts: 3301
Joined: Wed Jan 14, 2009 4:05 am
Location: Boo, I'm behind you.

Post by Khundon1975 » Thu Jan 21, 2010 6:49 pm

:idea: Could it be this one I wonder?

http://www.spraymepurfoam.com/index.php

Local office in Hua Hin.

17/29 Petkasem Rd. Soi 23
Bor-Fai
Hua Hin 77110
Tel.: 032 - 54.70.30
Fax: 032 - 54.75.13

:cheers:
I've lost my mind and I am making no effort to find it.

nevets
Guru
Guru
Posts: 636
Joined: Tue Apr 03, 2007 8:30 pm

Post by nevets » Thu Jan 21, 2010 7:38 pm

that's the one i posted but it wasn't a link , thanks for doing the link :cheers:

User avatar
steve/m
Member
Member
Posts: 91
Joined: Thu Sep 11, 2008 8:47 pm
Location: herts/huahin/cha am

Post by steve/m » Wed Feb 03, 2010 11:30 pm

If you go with the fibre option,minmum thickness should be 6inch, 10inch would be preferable.
I the uk the idea is to stop heat escaping through the roof,in los it works the other way,stops heat coming through the roof.
Unfortunately you wont have cavity walls which should also be insulated,with beads.
I can always insulate your roof for you,as its my job in the uk.

User avatar
crazy88
Ace
Ace
Posts: 1654
Joined: Thu Jun 21, 2007 7:39 am

Post by crazy88 » Thu Feb 04, 2010 12:46 pm

I use this one. Seems to do what it says on the tin. ie I am siiting in the house with no aircon and I am not hot,outside is stifling. Anyone got any informed opinions on this versus the cheaper foil ?

Crazy 88

Image
Image

User avatar
JimmyGreaves
Legend
Legend
Posts: 2852
Joined: Mon Oct 17, 2005 5:06 am
Location: HuaEireHin

Post by JimmyGreaves » Thu Feb 04, 2010 3:12 pm

crazy88 wrote:I use this one. Seems to do what it says on the tin. ie I am siiting in the house with no aircon and I am not hot,outside is stifling. Anyone got any informed opinions on this versus the cheaper foil ?

Crazy 88

Image
Image
You using this as well as foil under the roof tiles, crazy?
Diplomacy is the ability to tell a man to go to hell so that he looks forward to making the trip

Post Reply

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 5 guests