Property Lease

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CBinmore
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Property Lease

Post by CBinmore » Sun Feb 11, 2018 12:06 pm

On the topic of property leases - As we cannot own land in Thailand we need to lease. We see a lot of properties for sale with no remaining lease term advertised. How does this work? A/ Do we inherit the remaining lease term? B/ Do we apply for a new 30 year lease upon purchase of a house? C/ Does anyone know how much a new 30 year lease would cost?
Thank you,
Colin & Jackie

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Nereus
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Re: Property Lease

Post by Nereus » Sun Feb 11, 2018 12:47 pm

A lease is a contract between the land owner and whoever wants to lease it. I do not know if it is transferable, as it will depend on the wording in the original contract, but I doubt it. But if it was me I would insist on a new 30 year lease.

The lease has to be registered with the Land Department, and the cost is calculated on the total value of the 30 years, unless it has changed recently, which is quite possible the way things are done here! The tax payable is similar to what is called "stamp duty" in the West. The land owner will not pay it.

Legally, the land owner has to pay income tax on the lease payments, which again may affect how they want to word it.

The whole area of land leasing and or setting up a company, is fraught with pitfalls. Another option is what is called a "Usufruct", but which ever way you go a "good" lawer is a must, but you may have to bring one with you!

If you want to actually "own" a property here you may want to consider a Condominium.
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CBinmore
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Re: Property Lease

Post by CBinmore » Sun Feb 11, 2018 2:56 pm

Hello Nereuse,

Thank you for your quick response..

Colin..

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404cameljockey
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Re: Property Lease

Post by 404cameljockey » Sun Feb 11, 2018 5:40 pm

You should always be offered a new full 30 year lease. I believe that's normal. You should insist on a 30 + 30 + 30 year lease, with the extensions in your option only. You must have full right to sell the property on should you wish, and not be bound to offer the landowner any special right of or first refusal to purchase. The lease should also include a clause or clauses to the extent that: (1) you can pass all of your contractual rights and options on to your heirs or any persons you sell the property to; (2) details or your lease and your full rights/options are included in any sale contract should the current owner sell the land on to a third party and for them to be bound by them, with an obligation for them to pass on the exact same in any future land sale they may undertake; and (3) should the law change in the future to allow farang to own land as well as the structures built on it, the land purchase option is automatically extended to you, and this must be a part of any land sale contract that the current land owner includes in his sale contract. Also check whether the cost of the land has been contractually factored into the initial build/purchase price of the property (meaning there would be nothing more to pay for the land should you become able to purchase it).

Discuss all above points and more closely with a recommended attorney/solicitor. Good luck!

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Re: Property Lease

Post by Nereus » Sun Feb 11, 2018 5:51 pm

You should insist on a 30 + 30 + 30 year lease,
The Land Dept. will not register anything more that a 30 year lease. If you can have a separate contract with an option outside of the lease, you MAY be able to draw up a new lease at the end of the first one.
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Re: Property Lease

Post by CBinmore » Sun Feb 11, 2018 6:46 pm

Hi 404cameljockey...

Some great information here, thank you very much..

Colin & Jackie

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Re: Property Lease

Post by PET » Sun Feb 11, 2018 7:52 pm

The 30 year lease is the law the +30 and another+30 is something the lawyers have drawn up but it has not been tested to the best of my knowledge( tell me if it has) and it was not the Thai governments intention in the first place otherwise there would have been a provision. So up to you as they say.
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Re: Property Lease

Post by HHTel » Sun Feb 11, 2018 8:19 pm

I think agreements have been made outside the lease. Any hint on the original lease regarding renewals renders the whole lease illegal.
It's going to take some time to prove whether these private agreements are enforceable.
Can't be tested until the first 30 years has expired.
Will the original owner still be alive?
Will the law have changed?
Either way, the lawyer's fees for these agreements I'm sure are taken up front and the lawyer is long gone before anything can be tested.

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Re: Property Lease

Post by centermid7 » Sun Feb 11, 2018 8:54 pm

The 30/30/30 lease was made invalid by the courts of Phuket and was headed to the Thai Supreme Court although I don't know how that ended up. Indeed, if that is part of the contract even the first 30 years was ruled to be not enforceable.

30 years is the max.

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Re: Property Lease

Post by 404cameljockey » Mon Feb 12, 2018 7:15 am

I apologise for my sloppy description of the 30+30+30 year issue.

A land lease contract should show a 30 year agreement. A separate land lease agreement between land owner (lessor) and house purchaser (lessee) is drawn up with all other details, including registration cost, 30 year extensions, lessee's right to sublet, covenants on use by lessee, change to Thai law, etc. etc.

Your lawyer will guide you through this.

I'm sure the law will have been changed a few times in the initial 30 year period anyway, but if you can be prepared then why not? My own agreement (not contract) includes a 30+30+30 option with a clause to the effect that it will be enforceable by me or my heirs, etc. should the law change. That's not illegal and is still binding on the landowner.

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Re: Property Lease

Post by CBinmore » Mon Feb 12, 2018 10:42 am

Guys..

Thank you all for your response and the information. We are impressed with the content and the advice..

Best regards,

Colin & Jackie.

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Re: Property Lease

Post by laser » Mon Feb 12, 2018 1:40 pm

There was a much relevant news last month. The Cabinet recently approved a bill, awaiting enactment:
http://thailand-property-news.knightfra ... re-rights/.

According to the reports, lessees will be able to sublet the rented property, sell, mortgage or transfer the remaining term, and modify existing or construct new structures on the land. Heirs will automatically inherit the remaining lease. All these can be done without asking for the nod of the landowner.
.

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Re: Property Lease

Post by HHTel » Mon Feb 12, 2018 2:44 pm

All modifications and new structures does become the property of the owner when the lease ends. Being able to pass on the lease or sell the remaining time on the lease by law is a step forward. Until now this option had to be included in the lease agreement which of course has to be agreed by the owner.
The cabinet approved a new bill Tuesday granting more right to leaseholders who own land title deeds or condominiums.
That's a confusing statement because leaseholders do not own land title deeds!

It does give less control to landlords/owners but the 30 year max still remains.

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