Taleung - what is it?

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JD
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Post by JD »

Super Joe wrote:I've only been slapped 115 times :wink:

SJ
I heard 107 of them were backstage at the Blue Angel. :oops:

The other 8 were on stage during live shows. :shock:
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Super Joe
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Post by Super Joe »

JD wrote:
Super Joe wrote:I've only been slapped 115 times :wink:
SJ
I heard 107 of them were backstage at the Blue Angel. :oops:
The other 8 were on stage during live shows :shock:
LOL, just my luck to run into the HHAD moderator monthly night out. You lot could just give me a slap on here instead, God knows I deserve it :D

SJ
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Post by Roel »

ทะลึ่ง (with tonemark) and ทะลึง (without the tonemark) are two different words. This might cause some confusion whilst consulting the in-house linguist annex Thai partner due to using the wrong tone.

We are talking about the second ta-leung here.

I go with VincentD's explanation and would translate ta-leung with "naughty" if said with a smile and even with "perverse" if said without the smile and in a loud voice.

With regard to the gorilla mask scenario "too rate" as VincentD suggested would be a good typing. I have heard Thais also translate this as "bizarre".
But tam ling ทำลิง (act as a monkey) would not be bad either.
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Korkenzieher
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Post by Korkenzieher »

Roel,

The translation for 'saucy' is from the version with mai-eek, so I am talking about the first word. I don't think I've seen it written down without mai-eek. It would make it falling tone with and mid tone without. The 3-way dictionary has mai-eek and it is marked as falling tone (a caret).

If you have different meanings with the 2 tones, what are they (to see how different they might be). I certainly am happy with VincentD's usage, but ascribe that at the moment to the version with tone mark.

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Roel
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Post by Roel »

Okay, sorry I do not have the time and resources to look more closely into it right now. But this is what I found on Thai2English.

Actually if you type taleung with mai-ek it gives the following entry:

Image

However taleung without the mai-ek gives no entries, but if you search for "naughty" you get this:

Image

Note that the difference in tones is indicated in the transliteration.
Would not be the first time that dictionaries disagree with each other though!
If you find out more please let me know. I will do so as well.
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Post by PeteC »

If I'm not mistaken the term yaap-kaai means 'rude'. Pete :cheers:
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Post by Korkenzieher »

Roel,

I tried this on a couple of girls in town :oops: , just showing them the written word with and without the tone mark, and they all said that there was no difference - it was the same word. So in effect either the one without a tone mark appears to be a mis-spelling (for want of a better word), or it is mutable.

That said, I have seen the 'spring up' translation before, and it is one of the things that confused me about the word initially, particularly because of the specific context in which it was being used. However, the sources I have looked at clearly give the 'saucy, naughty' type translation to the one with the tone mark.

While no closer to solving that conundrum, I do actually feel, given the context, that I understand now what is being said.
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Post by Roel »

Khun Korkenzieher,

I agree that the version without the tone mark is probably a spelling mistake.

My Thai-Dutch dictionary give for taleung ทะลึ่ง (with tonemark) the following:
1. impolite, audacious, impertinent, bold, improper
2. abrupt, sudden, suddenly

Now you will agree that these words are not likely to come up in a (bar) field study simply because they are not part of their vocabulary. The results of the kind of field study that you conducted are as a rule mostly inadequate and unreliable.

Also the in-house linguist is not always a good source. The answer is not always as it looks. For instance I found out that when I ask my girlfriend if I can use a certain Thai word in a certain context that I describe to her the answer might be yes.

Howewer the full answer is not: "yes, the usage of this word in the described context is correct" but "yes, you can do whatever you want, up to you". :mrgreen:
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JD
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Post by JD »

Roel wrote:"yes, you can do whatever you want, up to you". :mrgreen:
Now if the above quote came up in conversation with one of the girls in town, it would definitely be Taleung Mahk. :oops:
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Post by Korkenzieher »

Khun Roel,

Nothing -erm- 'scientific' about my informal field study, you understand. :wink:

Context, as you rightly imply, is everything. And I rather suspect that any tonal differences can be laid at the door of emphasis much like the playful 'no' compared to the forceful not-this-side-of-the-gates-of-hell 'no'.

K.Kz
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