Psychiatry - A Dark Art

[lindosfan1]

Mr plum said
"Pharmaceutical companies ARE pitching their wares to the public then telling the viewers to ask their Doctor for the brand they are peddling. This is bad news for the simple reason their motivation is profit and they are intent on medicalizing every human experience. Psychiatrists and politicians are supporting this effort. It creates the belief in the viewers mind that common feelings and moods they experience are a 'mental illness' when they are just the normal trials of life. Are we to see romantic love twisted into a 'disease' that needs 'treatment'. Perhaps '9-11 truthers' are to be chemically 'coshed'?

I highlighted one particular bit where are your figures or evidence of this happening. I suspect it is more alarmist clap trap coming from an obscure source.
PROVE ME WRONG please

[Khundon1975]

Yes Sir K1975! Argument over Sir!!
The idea about the bus rides was only that a SUGGESTION and I admitted I don't know the logistics of the situation, It was only an attempt at a small contribution and I have no problem with it being rejected and putdown. It's not MY problem only trying to help because I too have been burglarized MANY times.
My 'goal" in this discussion is the exchange of info and ideas, a different perspective than ONLY the American media's one. It is not my goal to just win arguments. Even if I did win one that doesn't make me (or you) a more superior person by virtue of the fact. All it means is you have YOUR point of view from YOUR experience and I have mine I'm just trying to be more open minded by getting the viewpoint of others and I wouldn't presume to end the argument because it didn't agree with me.
That's a bit authoritarian don't you think?
DQ

LAnative

Of course we have different perspectives on the issue and that has to be respected. I'm not being authoritarian but I don't believe this discussion to be going anywhere if you believe that prison is not the place for drug dealers and other criminals.

That is why I said "end of argument" I don't want to waste time trying to convince you that your standpoint is wrong, I have better things to do with my time.

[caller]

I have to say that the bit Lindos has highlighted caught my attention too. Most GP's now use generic drugs rather than brand names (where copyright expired) as its cheaper for the practise they either manage or work in. Generally, if prescribed something and there is a cheaper over the counter alternative, its my experience that the Doctors will tell you about it, if not, the chemist will.

In fact, before I paid for a pre-payment certificate, meaning I collect prescriptions at a significantly discounted price, I routinely asked when prescribed something for a specific ailment, if there was a cheaper alternative?

I do agree with MrP though, that all '9/11 et al bores' should be chemically coshed - great idea!

[redzonerocker]

I do agree with MrP though, that all '9/11 et al bores' should be chemically coshed - great idea!

i also agree with mr p on this point

Psychiatrists and politicians are supporting this effort. It creates the belief in the viewers mind that common feelings and moods they experience are a 'mental illness' when they are just the normal trials of life.

[MrPlum]

I do agree with MrP though, that all '9/11 et al bores' should be chemically coshed - great idea!

Hey it was a question. Not a recommendation!

There is no direct-to-consumer (DTC) drug advertising allowed in the UK or EU as far as I'm aware. So obviously you will see it differently to those in the U.S. where ads are being pitched 24 x 7 and even Fox News has health spots which are nothing more than infomercials. There is a desire for cheaper health care in the U.S. and investigations have taken place into the role DTC plays in fostering a culture of non-generic prescribing.

This article is useful for understanding the issues...
http://www.pubmedcentral.nih.gov/articl ... id=1783915

I suspect it is more alarmist clap trap coming from an obscure source.
PROVE ME WRONG please

The trouble with 'suspecting' is it demonstrates all too clearly you don't bother to research before drawing your conclusions.

Here's a radical idea. YOU do the research and prove ME wrong.

LANative
The global warming debate has been had on here. Feel free to resurrect the thread if you feel you can add something new to it. Prepare to be coshed though.

[lindosfan1]

Mr PLUM
Having read the article about medical advertising, it proves to me how stupid people are. These companies advertising do so to make a profit, as you quite correctly say it is illegal in GB and the rest of the EU. I think the question is why do the U.S, government allow it is the corruption there it seems strange to allow it. Also it puts Doctors under pressure to treat diseases, that there is no evidence that the patient suffering from.
So I have two questions perhaps some one has the answer.
Why do the US government allow this advertising?
Why are Americans so stupid to believe all advertising.

It appears from the article written by doctors that they are not happy with this advertising either. Yes they are under pressure to prescribe but a good Doctor would not.
Thanks for that mr plum it just confirms what I thought about the US.
We must remember this NOT apply to doctors from the UK AND EU.

[Wanderlust]

lindosfan,
Can you provide evidence that a 'good' Doctor would not prescribe, given that you are so keen that Mr Plum provides evidence in everything else? Also how do you know that this does not apply to doctors from the UK and the EU? It works both ways you know. How 'stupid' people are should not be part of the equation. Is what is being done both within the law AND the right thing for everyone? Think about it.

[MrPlum]

Mr PLUM
Having read the article about medical advertising, it proves to me how stupid people are. These companies advertising do so to make a profit, as you quite correctly say it is illegal in GB and the rest of the EU. I think the question is why do the U.S, government allow it is the corruption there it seems strange to allow it. Also it puts Doctors under pressure to treat diseases, that there is no evidence that the patient suffering from.
So I have two questions perhaps some one has the answer.
Why do the US government allow this advertising?
Why are Americans so stupid to believe all advertising.

It appears from the article written by doctors that they are not happy with this advertising either. Yes they are under pressure to prescribe but a good Doctor would not.
Thanks for that mr plum it just confirms what I thought about the US.
We must remember this NOT apply to doctors from the UK AND EU.

'We must'. There's the Royal 'we' again. And 'must' is you giving others direction. lindosfan1. Please stick to attacking me and parroting SJ's opinions. At least he puts some thought behind his posts. Every time you venture an opinion, you show how little you know. You'll be telling me a scalpel is not a knife next.

So all Doctors who prescribe due to pressure are not good Doctors. Wow. That's quite a concession from you. Are you feeling okay? I thought all Doctors were qualified professionals who had studied for 7 years and taken the Hippocratic Oath? Why on earth would they be so 'stupid' to prescribe based on advertising and patient pressure?

Since this is a thread on Psychiatry and you are the self-proclaimed arbiter of what is 'rubbish' or not, perhaps you can explain what mental processes see Doctors act in such a fashion? Perhaps it's 'human nature syndrome' or 'perfectly understandable considering the amount of brainwashing phobia'? Or could it perhaps be 'free junkets to the Bahamas disorder'?

Since you are so knowledgeable can you also explain what criteria Non-US Doctors use to prescribe medications and whether there is any effort by pharmaceutical companies to influence their prescribing habits?

It would also be helpful if you could explain why it is that you feel qualified to call someone else 'useless'?

Good man.

[margaretcarnes]

Mr P and Lindosfan - true, 'direct to customer advertising' has, until now, been a no go area in the UK. But there are now TV ads here for a 'morning after' pill.
It may be a one off situation though due to concern over teenage pregnancies. Time will tell.

[hhfarang]

Why are Americans so stupid to believe all advertising.

Many believe that if it's on the "tube" or in the print media, it has to be true. (How do you think Obama got elected?... TV ads making him look like the returning of the Messiah...)

[LAnative]

Lindosfan1 As an American I will offer my opinion as to why Americans are so "stupid". ( Thank you. Your criticism is certainly unbiased)
Drug manufacurers are mostly American, with Swiss and Germans behind .
Americans believe what the advertising media tells them to as part of the manipulation of opinion. Some Americans buy the advertising because we are indoctrinated to believe the media. Many are told to follow like sheep. The writings of Nazi propogandist Hermann Goering are the model. The system is purposely being "dummed down" so that a market of undereducated, relatively affluent consumers are available to buy the drugs and the things China ( our owners) makes.
Drug sales help finance political campaigns. The Federal Drug Administration is infiltrated by the drug companies by appointment. Executives of the drug pushers sit on the FDA advisory board.
It is not in their interest to have the public informed on their product.

a dumb American

[Super Joe]

I'm amazed that the authorities in the US actually allow crack and meth ads to be broadcast on TV in the first place. Presumably they are only permitted after the 10pm 'safe-harbour' restriction?? In the Uk it's called the TV 'watershed' restriction but it's only 9pm, I guess that's due to the time-zone.
The big Pharma companies certainly make a small fortune off of these products.

SJ

[redzonerocker]

Some Americans buy the advertising because we are indoctrinated to believe the media. Many are told to follow like sheep.

the uk isn't a lot different
i think the gp's play a major part in the process (despite what lindos says ), they have their prescription book out before you've had a chance to sit down & tell them what the problem is

[caller]

Whoa RZR, lets have less of the generalisations!

I'm on my third group practice in less than 5 years and in my experience, none have been keen to prescribe unless absolutely neccessary.

[Big Boy]

And mine certainly won't prescribe a brand name when there is an unbranded version available at a cheaper price eg he told me I needed E45, and prescribed Lloyds Aqueous Cream.