Throughout the year, Cha Am is actually very busy over the weekends with Thai visitors from Bangkok. Hua Hin is becoming more popular for Thais for a weekend / Thai holiday destination. Most 'Falang businesses' don't (or cant) tap into this Thai market but IMO a good entrepreneur should be looking to see how (or if) this could be done. Obviously, if you can tap into the Thai market you are less vulnerable to reliance on the fragile tourist numbers.shunpike wrote:How about the BKK Thais, are they still coming in big numbers? I was in Ch-am two weeks ago, also did some running around in HH. Saw lots of BKK licence plates about. It was a long weekend so that may explain alot.
Number of tourists?
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Khundon1975
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JoeDoc wrote
"Throughout the year, Cha Am is actually very busy over the weekends with Thai visitors from Bangkok. Hua Hin is becoming more popular for Thais for a weekend / Thai holiday destination. Most 'Falang businesses' don't (or cant) tap into this Thai market but IMO a good entrepreneur should be looking to see how (or if) this could be done. Obviously, if you can tap into the Thai market you are less vulnerable to reliance on the fragile tourist numbers".
A good point Joe Doc, we tapped into the Bangkok set for the coffee shop and it has gone from strength to strength and whilst we had quite a few foriegn customers (mainly families), the main clientel were Thai.
The wife, who speakes to her family who run the coffee shop on a daily basis, have told her they have taken on 3 extra staff to cope with the extra trade and have had to resort to closing the gates as they get so busy, especially at weekends
SuperJoe wrote
"Regards property, while it's been hovering just above dead for the past year or so, people (incl. me) who are continuing to build or buy land believe that when the recession is over Hua Hin/Cha Am will still be popular due to Phuket being so much more expensive due to their lack of land. Time will tell on that one".
I'm sure you are correct in this, though getting land in HH at a sensible price is still not easy, as the Thais don't want to sell it at a realistic price at the moment.
The wife drives me crazy every time a land deal goes pear shaped, when they put up the price at the last minute.
1 in 4 deals goes bad.
Still, we firmly believe now is the time to buy in HH, prices are bound to go up sooner or later and decent plots are getting harder to find.
I'm glad I cannot buy or own land in LOS, it would drive me crazy as well.
Edit to add last line.
"Throughout the year, Cha Am is actually very busy over the weekends with Thai visitors from Bangkok. Hua Hin is becoming more popular for Thais for a weekend / Thai holiday destination. Most 'Falang businesses' don't (or cant) tap into this Thai market but IMO a good entrepreneur should be looking to see how (or if) this could be done. Obviously, if you can tap into the Thai market you are less vulnerable to reliance on the fragile tourist numbers".
A good point Joe Doc, we tapped into the Bangkok set for the coffee shop and it has gone from strength to strength and whilst we had quite a few foriegn customers (mainly families), the main clientel were Thai.
The wife, who speakes to her family who run the coffee shop on a daily basis, have told her they have taken on 3 extra staff to cope with the extra trade and have had to resort to closing the gates as they get so busy, especially at weekends
SuperJoe wrote
"Regards property, while it's been hovering just above dead for the past year or so, people (incl. me) who are continuing to build or buy land believe that when the recession is over Hua Hin/Cha Am will still be popular due to Phuket being so much more expensive due to their lack of land. Time will tell on that one".
I'm sure you are correct in this, though getting land in HH at a sensible price is still not easy, as the Thais don't want to sell it at a realistic price at the moment.
The wife drives me crazy every time a land deal goes pear shaped, when they put up the price at the last minute.
1 in 4 deals goes bad.Still, we firmly believe now is the time to buy in HH, prices are bound to go up sooner or later and decent plots are getting harder to find.
I'm glad I cannot buy or own land in LOS, it would drive me crazy as well.
Edit to add last line.
I've lost my mind and I am making no effort to find it.
So far
From what I have observed, Hua Hin is still very quiet for what is supposed to be "high season". The hotels I am familiar with are half filled at best, our Bangkok Thai neighbors have not appeared in many months and I can still get my favorite parking place in town. (It also just feels like it is low season . . .the hustle and bustle isnt there, even on weekends.)
I have also noticed that there are more tuk-tuks around than usual and more hill people . . but they dont seem to be doing much business.
On the plus side (?) the town has outdone itself with the Xmas lighting this year. Spectacular displays, especially the street in front of the park. However, I dont think that this will draw visitors either foreign or domestic. Decorating is one thing the town fathers excell at . .but the cost of placing and running all those lights must be a huge budget item. I drove through town at 3:00 AM the other night and every single light was still lit.
I have also noticed that there are more tuk-tuks around than usual and more hill people . . but they dont seem to be doing much business.
On the plus side (?) the town has outdone itself with the Xmas lighting this year. Spectacular displays, especially the street in front of the park. However, I dont think that this will draw visitors either foreign or domestic. Decorating is one thing the town fathers excell at . .but the cost of placing and running all those lights must be a huge budget item. I drove through town at 3:00 AM the other night and every single light was still lit.
My wife says those were put up for the King's birthday (not Christmas), and will probably be left up and used at least through New Year.On the plus side (?) the town has outdone itself with the Xmas lighting this year.
My brain is like an Internet browser; 12 tabs are open and 5 of them are not responding, there's a GIF playing in an endless loop,... and where is that annoying music coming from?
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Korkenzieher
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My take is (predictably, I suppose) slightly different.
I think there has been a near total collapse of seasonal family tourism, and much of this can be laid at the door of the PAD taking over the airport. When families book their holiday, it tends to be shortly after the return from the previous one, meaning the news would still be reasonably fresh in the mind. As others have pointed out, tourism was declining anyway, post Tsunami, post Coup but the decline since last year has been major scale. Undoubtedly the economies of the western world have played their part, but no-one wants to get trapped here and lose a job, as was frequently read about last year. They've gone to the Med this year.
Second homers / long stayers will come, because they have a certain commitment to the country through their property.
Numbers in the streets - early doors it is almost all single middle aged men - perhaps golfers - who go to a bar early, leave early (usually accompanied) and don't appear come back (at least their escort doesn't reappear). I suspect many of these have taken advantage of the generous 'last minute' deals on offer, but may have come anyway. Any 'high season' upswing will be dependant on these arrivals, IMHO.
Later in the evening, a few more come out but generally by 12 it is done & dusted. Last year Sam Sam bar at 3am was 3-4 deep at the bar at this time of year. This year, I can walk in and have a selection of seats at the bar to choose from.
There is certainly an influx of girls and some of them are certainly getting business but the bars are in general very quiet. A few weeks back (comparing apples with oranges) Phuket was probably actually quieter than Hua Hin, belying its greater dependence on tradtional tourism, as opposed to residential customers who I suspect form a larger proportion of HH business.
I think there has been a near total collapse of seasonal family tourism, and much of this can be laid at the door of the PAD taking over the airport. When families book their holiday, it tends to be shortly after the return from the previous one, meaning the news would still be reasonably fresh in the mind. As others have pointed out, tourism was declining anyway, post Tsunami, post Coup but the decline since last year has been major scale. Undoubtedly the economies of the western world have played their part, but no-one wants to get trapped here and lose a job, as was frequently read about last year. They've gone to the Med this year.
Second homers / long stayers will come, because they have a certain commitment to the country through their property.
Numbers in the streets - early doors it is almost all single middle aged men - perhaps golfers - who go to a bar early, leave early (usually accompanied) and don't appear come back (at least their escort doesn't reappear). I suspect many of these have taken advantage of the generous 'last minute' deals on offer, but may have come anyway. Any 'high season' upswing will be dependant on these arrivals, IMHO.
Later in the evening, a few more come out but generally by 12 it is done & dusted. Last year Sam Sam bar at 3am was 3-4 deep at the bar at this time of year. This year, I can walk in and have a selection of seats at the bar to choose from.
There is certainly an influx of girls and some of them are certainly getting business but the bars are in general very quiet. A few weeks back (comparing apples with oranges) Phuket was probably actually quieter than Hua Hin, belying its greater dependence on tradtional tourism, as opposed to residential customers who I suspect form a larger proportion of HH business.
Had enough of the trolls. Going to sleep. I may be some time....
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Korkenzieher
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With regard to the airport (before people go all red & yellow on me), the other highly publicised trouble flare-ups (Asean, Din Daeng etc.) will not have helped, but the Airport takeover is what caused many government foreign ministries to issue travel warnings to Thailand, and it is this which will have affected both the cost and absolute availability of insurance products to the 'high value' travel industry.
Had enough of the trolls. Going to sleep. I may be some time....
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dtaai-maai
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Couldn't agree more. Recently I've driven through places like Cha-am, Petchaburi and Ratchaburi (and towns between) quite regularly, and the general upkeep and level of decoration along the main roads combined with the clearing-up of discarded plastic bags and bottles puts HH to shame.moja wrote:I too agree with JoeDoc but we all have to take an honest look at the town; it is at best scruffy.
This is the way
Re: this point, it's compounded by the fact that many expats living here full time are also cutting back and going out/spending less. Their income has also been diminished if they have a local business dependant upon tourists, or hit by exchange rates, savings interest rates etc.Korkenzieher wrote:Later in the evening, a few more come out but generally by 12 it is done & dusted. Last year Sam Sam bar at 3am was 3-4 deep at the bar at this time of year. This year, I can walk in and have a selection of seats at the bar to choose from.
While they are not tourists, so a bit off-topic, they are adding to the pain of certain local businesses.
SJ
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Korkenzieher
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Well, no question that some residents have been hit by adverse currency movements, and that certainly isn't helping.
At about midnight today, I walked around the square, and at 7 days before Christmas, I have to say it was borderline desolate. Quite sad really. I wouldn't have believed it could have gotten much worse than last year, but it has. Much worse!
At about midnight today, I walked around the square, and at 7 days before Christmas, I have to say it was borderline desolate. Quite sad really. I wouldn't have believed it could have gotten much worse than last year, but it has. Much worse!
Had enough of the trolls. Going to sleep. I may be some time....
I don't think Hua Hin is alone with this situation. We've done some Christmas shopping trips to Pattaya malls this past week and it's quiet there also. The normal expats wandering around and sitting at beer bars, but not the usual high season foreign tourist presence by any means. Both pedestrian and vehicle traffic is light. We didn't stay the evening or go to Walking Street though, which is usually the best time and place to get an accurate reading. Pete
Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed. Source
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margaretcarnes
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Number of tourists?
I agree largely with JoeDoc - but that post tsunami regeneration of interest in Phuket was, I think , more due to two things. The sympathy factor - Phuket did suffer - and did need tourist input. And the voyeuristic element - 'we've been to Phuket' type people.
HuaHin could have picked up on the type of popularity once enjoyed by Phuket, but is still pretty much unheard of, certainly in the UK. Time and time again over the last 5 years, when asked, I've told people where I lived in Thailand. Not once has anyone heard of it. In fact many people over here only stumble across the name HuaHin when they go to book a special holiday in Thailand, and are sold the Dusit or similar. It's the hotel first, and HH second.
Up to about 2003 there was still a pretty good backpacker trade in HH, but it was wrecked - IMO - by the likes of the Lonely Planet. Still saying people could get a room for 50 baht, when in fact we struggled to rent a basic room for 150. The backpackers started to go elsewhere, and land owners in HH imagined they could just as easily attract higher end tourists, and started to build city centre hotels, which have to be mid/high range room prices to cover their outlay. But for your average package tourist the major part of the cost is the flight, so they will opt for a hotel chain they have heard of - like the Dusit or Marriott - rather than a Sunshine or JedPeeNong.
The only exceptions in central HH are of course the Hilton and Sofitel, which will survive on their reputations as they have done for years.
Of course the recession has had an impact to an extent. But plenty of people still travel, and given the right promotion - and commitment - by the TAT, HuaHin could easily be put on the world tourist map.
Which begs the question - why don't they promote it? And I'm afraid part of the answer is maybe that they don't think they need to. HH is already well populated by farang anyway.
HuaHin could have picked up on the type of popularity once enjoyed by Phuket, but is still pretty much unheard of, certainly in the UK. Time and time again over the last 5 years, when asked, I've told people where I lived in Thailand. Not once has anyone heard of it. In fact many people over here only stumble across the name HuaHin when they go to book a special holiday in Thailand, and are sold the Dusit or similar. It's the hotel first, and HH second.
Up to about 2003 there was still a pretty good backpacker trade in HH, but it was wrecked - IMO - by the likes of the Lonely Planet. Still saying people could get a room for 50 baht, when in fact we struggled to rent a basic room for 150. The backpackers started to go elsewhere, and land owners in HH imagined they could just as easily attract higher end tourists, and started to build city centre hotels, which have to be mid/high range room prices to cover their outlay. But for your average package tourist the major part of the cost is the flight, so they will opt for a hotel chain they have heard of - like the Dusit or Marriott - rather than a Sunshine or JedPeeNong.
The only exceptions in central HH are of course the Hilton and Sofitel, which will survive on their reputations as they have done for years.
Of course the recession has had an impact to an extent. But plenty of people still travel, and given the right promotion - and commitment - by the TAT, HuaHin could easily be put on the world tourist map.
Which begs the question - why don't they promote it? And I'm afraid part of the answer is maybe that they don't think they need to. HH is already well populated by farang anyway.
A sprout is for life - not just for Christmas.
When the Thai authorities promote Thailand as a tourist destination the least they can do is to promote Thailand and not Scotland as they do here:
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/travel/artic ... esort.html
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/travel/artic ... esort.html
I intend to live forever - so far so good.
Re: Number of tourists?
Interesting post Mags. the best bit was "I agree largely with JoeDoc"margaretcarnes wrote:I agree largely with JoeDoc - but that post tsunami regeneration of interest in Phuket was, I think , more due to two things. The sympathy factor - Phuket did suffer - and did need tourist input. And the voyeuristic element - 'we've been to Phuket' type people.
HuaHin could have picked up on the type of popularity once enjoyed by Phuket, but is still pretty much unheard of, certainly in the UK. Time and time again over the last 5 years, when asked, I've told people where I lived in Thailand. Not once has anyone heard of it. In fact many people over here only stumble across the name HuaHin when they go to book a special holiday in Thailand, and are sold the Dusit or similar. It's the hotel first, and HH second.
Up to about 2003 there was still a pretty good backpacker trade in HH, but it was wrecked - IMO - by the likes of the Lonely Planet. Still saying people could get a room for 50 baht, when in fact we struggled to rent a basic room for 150. The backpackers started to go elsewhere, and land owners in HH imagined they could just as easily attract higher end tourists, and started to build city centre hotels, which have to be mid/high range room prices to cover their outlay. But for your average package tourist the major part of the cost is the flight, so they will opt for a hotel chain they have heard of - like the Dusit or Marriott - rather than a Sunshine or JedPeeNong.
The only exceptions in central HH are of course the Hilton and Sofitel, which will survive on their reputations as they have done for years.
Of course the recession has had an impact to an extent. But plenty of people still travel, and given the right promotion - and commitment - by the TAT, HuaHin could easily be put on the world tourist map.
Which begs the question - why don't they promote it? And I'm afraid part of the answer is maybe that they don't think they need to. HH is already well populated by farang anyway.
but seriously - its true you hardly see any backpackers anymore and not many people have ever heard of Hua Hin. You also said "Which begs the question - why don't they promote it?" - IMO I think the Thai authorities would rather promote Hua Hin to Thais as mainly a high-end Thai resort for Thais.
Just think how wonderful Scotland might be if Global Warming is true!Norseman wrote:When the Thai authorities promote Thailand as a tourist destination the least they can do is to promote Thailand and not Scotland as they do here:
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/travel/artic ... esort.html
