Would Thailand have benefited if it had been Colonized?

General chat about life in the Land Of Smiles. Discuss expat life, relationship issues and all things generally Thailand and Asia related.

Would Thailand have benefited if it had been Colonized?

Yes
7
47%
No
8
53%
 
Total votes: 15

User avatar
PeteC
Moderator
Moderator
Posts: 32338
Joined: Tue Mar 23, 2004 7:58 am
Location: All Blacks training camp

Would Thailand have benefited if it had been Colonized?

Post by PeteC »

A very broad question and very limited poll choices. Think of five things that take place with colonization, and if three or more are positive, vote yes.

The Thais pride themselves and boast that the country has never been colonized, but have they ever looked at the other side of the coin to understand the benefits had they been colonized?

I realize that as GOFES (Grumpy Old Fart Expats) read this thread they will no doubt say "NO...we like things the way they are. The country is quaint and provides entertainment in the way it's managed, and it's a jolly good show...." Deep down inside however I'll bet the ranch they have the exact same feelings that I'll express here and as others will in reply.

No research on my part, just thinking about what I've learned and experienced, indeed the British did it much better than the French, Spanish, Dutch and Belgians IMO. The USA was founded by a handful of British men and except for the Monarchy, the structure of government is basically the same, but goes by other names.

Focusing on Asia, compare Singapore, Malaysia, India and Hong Kong to countries colonized by other European countries and I think the consensus will bear out what I say above. Malaysia has been diluted by Muslim thinking unfortunately, but before you poo-poo India, look at the intelligence and quality of the graduates they're turning out. We really need to discount Burma, Vietnam, Laos and Cambodia because of events such as the Khumer Rouge and military/communist disposal of all aspects of former colonization in those places, both good and bad.

So, what if Thailand had been colonized for say 100 years during the 18th and 19th centuries before given its independence?

1) The Monarchy would be much as it is now, a constitutional monarchy.
2) The ongoing modern feudal system and the patronage system would not exist.
3) Corruption would be much less than it is now, and controlled better such as it is in Hong Kong by the ICAC.
4) The financial system would be the same as it is now, as it has all already been copied from the west.
5) The education system would be light years ahead of where it currently is.
6) The standard of living for everyone (key point) would be about 3/4 of what Singapore is IMO.
7) Agricultural practices/production/sustainability would be on a par with France given the similarity in size of country.
8 ) The environment would be in much better shape.

There's probably more benefits but I'll stop there and let others contribute. I'll let others go into the bad points of colonization and there are some...but which wins the day...yes or no?

The sad point is that Thailand has always been colonized and is today, by its own upper class people. Another sad point is that a charlatan has taken up the banner of the poor and the fight for independence...IMO. Pete :cheers:
Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed. Source
User avatar
richard
Deceased
Deceased
Posts: 8780
Joined: Tue Feb 18, 2003 1:59 pm
Location: Wherever I am today

Re: Would Thailand have benefited if it had been Colonized?

Post by richard »

I thought Thailand had already been colonised by China
RICHARD OF LOXLEY

It’s none of my business what people say and think of me. I am what I am and do what I do. I expect nothing and accept everything. It makes life so much easier.
User avatar
pharvey
Moderator
Moderator
Posts: 15851
Joined: Sat Aug 29, 2009 10:21 am
Location: Sir Fynwy - God's Country

Re: Would Thailand have benefited if it had been Colonized?

Post by pharvey »

Well, India was "colonised" - put that into just a few of the points you raised: -

Less corruption?
Better schooling?
Better standard of living for EVERYONE?
Environment?

Did India go "backwards" after independence (1947)? Was British "rule" the cause of many problems?

Whilst I've worked in Thailand on several projects and lived there off and on for around 5 years, I certainly wouldn't profess to know enough to answer the OP. Certainly an interesting question though!!

:cheers: :cheers:
"Hope is a good thing, maybe the best of things" - Yma o Hyd.
User avatar
PeteC
Moderator
Moderator
Posts: 32338
Joined: Tue Mar 23, 2004 7:58 am
Location: All Blacks training camp

Re: Would Thailand have benefited if it had been Colonized?

Post by PeteC »

Bloody hell...you're trying to "colonise" the colonization thread! :lach: Pete :cheers:
Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed. Source
User avatar
MrPlum
Banned
Banned
Posts: 4568
Joined: Mon Jun 11, 2007 6:57 pm

Re: Would Thailand have benefited if it had been Colonized?

Post by MrPlum »

What's left to colonize? McDonalds, Pepsi, modern medicine, industrial development, GM crops, junk food, central banking, ATMs, western pop music, movies and TV, stock markets, a 2-party 'democratic' system. All here.

No rail system to speak of but I can't think of much else that is lacking, beyond the fact that our set of scoundrels isn't in charge. There is a bigger gap between rich and poor than most, however, the poor, though, as with different religions, aren't suffering as much as we might think because they grew up with it. :idea:
lindosfan1
Deceased
Deceased
Posts: 4069
Joined: Wed Mar 05, 2008 1:26 pm
Location: uk

Re: Would Thailand have benefited if it had been Colonized?

Post by lindosfan1 »

Colonise is totake over somewhere for for ones own use, a polite name for war.
You cannot discount Burma or Vietnam they were colonised look at what Burma is like now.
Taking it further afield Africa was colonised and thousands of the occupants exported to America for use as slaves very good!!! India is a good example look at the poverty and corruption there, some of the most corrupt countries in the world were colonised.
Colonisation is another name for war, financial gain.
The original spelling of colonise was spelt with an s not a z that is an American bastardisation of the English language. :(
Woke up this morning breathing that's a good start to the day.
User avatar
PeteC
Moderator
Moderator
Posts: 32338
Joined: Tue Mar 23, 2004 7:58 am
Location: All Blacks training camp

Re: Would Thailand have benefited if it had been Colonized?

Post by PeteC »

pharvey wrote:Well, India was "colonised" - put that into just a few of the points you raised: -

Less corruption?
Better schooling?
Better standard of living for EVERYONE?
Environment?

Did India go "backwards" after independence (1947)? Was British "rule" the cause of many problems?
I think India was simply too large Pharvey. Even 1947 the population was probably at least 400 million + compared to Thailand NOW at 65. Huge geographic area and Hindus facing off with an almost equal number of Muslims...plus WWII having drained your resources.

Speaking of WWII, the Thais did a paper thing with the Japanese saving their "never coloniz(s)ed status. Nonsense. Pete :cheers:
Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed. Source
User avatar
pharvey
Moderator
Moderator
Posts: 15851
Joined: Sat Aug 29, 2009 10:21 am
Location: Sir Fynwy - God's Country

Re: Would Thailand have benefited if it had been Colonized?

Post by pharvey »

prcscct wrote:Bloody hell...you're trying to "colonise" the colonization thread! :lach: Pete :cheers:
:lach: My humble apologies.... force of habit!!
"Hope is a good thing, maybe the best of things" - Yma o Hyd.
User avatar
PeteC
Moderator
Moderator
Posts: 32338
Joined: Tue Mar 23, 2004 7:58 am
Location: All Blacks training camp

Re: Would Thailand have benefited if it had been Colonized?

Post by PeteC »

lindosfan1 wrote:.......The original spelling of colonise was spelt with an s not a z that is an American bastardisation of the English language. :(
Yes, Lindosfan, you never fail to bring up things like that these days. How about reading the contents of the thread as it applies to Thailand and the points made. You want a soap box...start a a thread.
Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed. Source
User avatar
pharvey
Moderator
Moderator
Posts: 15851
Joined: Sat Aug 29, 2009 10:21 am
Location: Sir Fynwy - God's Country

Re: Would Thailand have benefited if it had been Colonized?

Post by pharvey »

prcscct wrote:
pharvey wrote:Well, India was "colonised" - put that into just a few of the points you raised: -

Less corruption?
Better schooling?
Better standard of living for EVERYONE?
Environment?

Did India go "backwards" after independence (1947)? Was British "rule" the cause of many problems?
I think India was simply too large Pharvey. Even 1947 the population was probably at least 400 million + compared to Thailand NOW at 65. Huge geographic area and Hindus facing off with an almost equal number of Muslims...plus WWII having drained your resources.

Speaking of WWII, the Thais did a paper thing with the Japanese saving their "never coloniz(s)ed status. Nonsense. Pete :cheers:
Yes, the Japanese "paper" - absolute nonsense.

If you take India (i.e. population) as too large, then the same question for "Sub-Saharan Africa" (unfortunately also not a great note for Britain): -

Botswana, The Gambia, Ghana, Kenya, Lesotho, Malawi, Namibia, Nigeria, Sierra Leone, Somalia, Sudan, Swaziland, Tanzania, Uganda, Zambia, Zimbabwe, South Africa

Mr P also has a point ( :shock: ) regarding coloniz(s)ation ( :D ) of Thailand with regards to the huge international corporations - what's the true definition?

:cheers: :cheers:
"Hope is a good thing, maybe the best of things" - Yma o Hyd.
User avatar
PeteC
Moderator
Moderator
Posts: 32338
Joined: Tue Mar 23, 2004 7:58 am
Location: All Blacks training camp

Re: Would Thailand have benefited if it had been Colonized?

Post by PeteC »

A true definition is that "..if it's in the national interest..." I'm not going to research it but I'm sure your Parliament said that thousands of times in the 18th, 19th and early 20th centuries. America really started to say it after WWII and still does today. For sure, we're all smiles and lollipops and the benefits are huge concerning food, money, development etc., but it is indeed all in the national interest. Why shouldn't it be? It's my and every American's tax money that's being bled out.

BUT.......let's try to get back to the the Thailand scenario to see what folks think specifically about that. Pete :cheers:
Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed. Source
User avatar
Big Boy
Moderator
Moderator
Posts: 49305
Joined: Fri Nov 04, 2005 7:36 pm
Location: Bon Kai

Re: Would Thailand have benefited if it had been Colonized?

Post by Big Boy »

I'm quite happy to be living in Thailand, with a Thai influence - not maybe French-Thailand.

However, it's all academic these days with Westernised malls, fast food joints etc popping up everywhere. Without colonisation, the Western world is significantly influencing the future Thailand - big time.
Championship Plymouth Argyle 1 - 2 Leeds Utd :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry:

Points 46; Position 23 RELEGATED :cry: :cry:
lindosfan1
Deceased
Deceased
Posts: 4069
Joined: Wed Mar 05, 2008 1:26 pm
Location: uk

Re: Would Thailand have benefited if it had been Colonized?

Post by lindosfan1 »

prscct with respect what I stated is correct, if you want Thailand to be like Burma Vietnam and numerous other countries in the world, the colonisation would have been
good, but I suggest you and many others would not be living there.
That is why I voted no. Nowhere is perfect in the world. Do I want it to be like France, no agriculture is so good in France that is why are so many protests by farmers. The standard of living would be 3/4 of Singapore standards, possibly but it could also be as bad as Burma.
mr plum said
What's left to colonize? McDonalds, Pepsi, modern medicine, industrial development, GM crops, junk food, central banking, ATMs, western pop music, movies and TV, stock markets, a 2-party 'democratic' system. All here.
That is true some of it is good but mcdonalds tescos gm crops junk food 2 party democratic system Thailand does not need them.
Taking it further why don't the Asian countries unite and call them selves the Asian union, the EU is the biggest con trick ever do you want that in Thailand.
Woke up this morning breathing that's a good start to the day.
lindosfan1
Deceased
Deceased
Posts: 4069
Joined: Wed Mar 05, 2008 1:26 pm
Location: uk

Re: Would Thailand have benefited if it had been Colonized?

Post by lindosfan1 »

prscct said
For sure, we're all smiles and lollipops and the benefits are huge concerning food, money, development etc., but it is indeed all in the national interest. Why shouldn't it be? It's my and every American's tax money that's being bled out.
Whose national interest?? American??
It is about time larger financial countries stopped buying their way into other countries. sorry that is off topic or is it, it is another method of colonisation
Woke up this morning breathing that's a good start to the day.
GLCQuantum
Rock Star
Rock Star
Posts: 3583
Joined: Tue Feb 20, 2007 2:00 pm

Re: Would Thailand have benefited if it had been Colonized?

Post by GLCQuantum »

Taking it further why don't the Asian countries unite and call them selves the Asian union
Not too far away from that. China will never join as they are already the Superpower of the world... they don't need the others. Asean on the other hand is what you are talking about lindosfan. Only 10 countries in it so far but watch all the others get a piece of the pie.

The EU *same same* Asean.

Won't be long until they are using the same currency. :D
Post Reply