Ex-Thai PM 'to face murder charge'

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sargeant
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Re: Ex-Thai PM 'to face murder charge'

Post by sargeant »

Quote Steve
and I think we are all perhaps making the mistake of seeing this as a conflict of two sides when there are actually several more.
Please note the large letters had you added except sargeant who has banged on and on about a third party and in particular the ninjas i may have been able to ignore it and get on with my trip up country

merry xmas to all and a good new year :D :D :D
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Re: Ex-Thai PM 'to face murder charge'

Post by Big Boy »

Guys,

You are starting to get very personal again. I've removed the latest drivel. Please take this as a final warning - if you can't discuss things civally, without resorting to personal abuse, the thread will have to be locked.
Championship Plymouth Argyle 1 - 2 Leeds Utd :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry:

Points 46; Position 23 RELEGATED :cry: :cry:
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Re: Ex-Thai PM 'to face murder charge'

Post by sargeant »

Whilst looking up a point that was made to me which i am still researching i came across this little gem courtesy of wikipedia about the war on drugs
While he was opposition leader, Abhisit Vejjajiva accused Thaksin of crimes against humanity for his alleged role in the campaign. After being appointed Prime Minister, Abhisit opened an investigation into the killings, claiming that a successful probe could lead to prosecution by the International Criminal Court. Former attorney-general Kampee Kaewcharoen led the investigation and the investigation committee was approved by Abhisit's Cabinet. Abhisit denied that the probe was politically motivated. Witnesses and victims were urged to report to the Department of Special Investigation, which operated directly under Abhisit's control.[80][91][92] As of the August 2011 parliamentary elections, Abhisit's investigation failed to find or publicize any conclusive evidence linking Thaksin or members of his Government to any extrajudicial killings.

The word OOPs springs immediately to mind or maybe som nam nah

It certainly means in spades reference to drug wars on this thread is spurious, misleading and irelevant but mostly totally wrong
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Re: Ex-Thai PM 'to face murder charge'

Post by sargeant »

http://anfrel.org/thai-political-timeline/
4 Apr 2006
After an audience with King Bhumibol and under increasing pressure, Thaksin announces that he would not accept the post of Prime Minister after the Parliament reconvenes but that he would continue to be Caretaker Prime Minister until his successor is elected by the Parliament.
Apr-May 2006
Thaksin takes a seven-week break from politics, but returns as caretaker Prime Minister and struggles to schedule a new election over increasing legal challenges.
8 May 2006
The Constitution Court invalidates the results of the April elections and calls for new elections.
30 May 2006
The Cabinet endorses an Election Commission proposal to hold a new round of elections on 15 October 2006.
24 Aug 2006
Thaksin accuses several army officers of plotting to kill him after police find a car containing bomb-making materials near his house.
19 Sep 2006
Military launches a coup detat while Thaksin is in New York at the UN General Assembly. Lead by General Sonthi Boonyaratglin, the coup leaders brand themselves the Council for Democratic Reform (CDR), suspend the constitution, and dissolve the Cabinet, both houses of Parliament, and the Constitutional Court. Coup leaders later refer to themselves as the Council for National Security (CNS)

Question why did they not wait for the election and that WAS just a couple of weeks

Facts are what we should all use to form our opinions for if we do not our opinions are bogus
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Re: Ex-Thai PM 'to face murder charge'

Post by cozza »

I think thats a very valid point...why didn't they wait?

To be honest though, we dont really know if there could be other reasons why they did not wait but, yea from my point of view it looks silly.

I still think that Thai politics is ridiculous and not worth taking sides...I think it has bought more harm than good especially with all the protests. That being said, if Thaksin backed away and left politics for real, I wonder if it would bring more peace and stability...I think many Thai's do, though who am I to argue with them?
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Re: Ex-Thai PM 'to face murder charge'

Post by cozza »

From the Bangkok Post - Voranai Vanijaka

Pigs walk on two legs
The skywalk is just right there, perhaps not more than 10 metres away, yet the people – old, young and parents with little children – run across the streets illegally and dangerously, rather than just take the time and use the skywalk, legally and properly.

So when it comes to political conflict, it is not a wonder that those involved would rather resort to the illegal and the dangerous, rather than rely on what is legal and proper, the democratic process.

Why? Convenience, laziness, recklessness, a penchant for quick fixes with no mind to the consequences, this also explains the plastic surgery craze. Hence we are where we are today. Thailand today is not the big mango, it’s the big mess. But here's another chance where we can turn to the democratic process, the legal and proper way to do things.

When an issue is so controversial and so contentious that it threatens to pull society apart, the democratic process has a failsafe; it is called a public referendum. Presently, arguments abound on whether or not we should hold one on the issue of charter amendment.

The proposed charter amendment by the Pheu Thai government may lead to amnesty for all those involved in the political conflicts since the September 2006 military coup d'etat. But that’s a secondary issue.

The primary issue is Section 309 of the constitution, which gives legal protection to the Assets Scrutiny Committee which brought former prime minister Thaksin Shinawatra's case to court. This could be nullified.

Let’s cut the BS and get to the point. This is first and foremost about the return and exoneration of Thaksin. Thailand’s dilemma may have been decades in the making. There might be many characters both visible and invisible in this present conflict. But this referendum is primarily about one man.

Instead of being coy and cryptic, it would be nice if the Pheu Thai party admits this because, at least in the eye of this writer, if that’s what the majority of the people want, so be it. Honesty is such a lonely word, don’t you think? And if the opposition Democrat Party wants to fight this tooth and nail, so be it.

Hold this public referendum and if the votes swing Pheu Thai’s way, then pop the corks and roll out the red carpet. If the votes swing the Democrat’s way, then see you in Dubai, or Macau, or Singapore, or Hong Kong, or Cambodia.

There, the issue ends, or so it should.

The reason why even a public referendum itself is controversial and contentious is because we the people and politicians of Thailand do not like a measuring stick. We prefer to wing it and change the rules as we go along, make up stuff us we go along.

But dear people and politicians, we need a standard, a measuring stick; otherwise there is no rhyme to our thoughts nor reason to our actions. A measuring stick is a benchmark, quality assurance, standard measurement, ISO certificate, grading and examination and more.

When we don’t have a benchmark, we corrupt our words and actions. Take an easy example of the yellow-shirt People's Alliance for Democracy (PAD) and the red-shirt United Front for Democracy against Dictatorship (UDD). How the term “democracy” makes it into these two brands is a testament of making up stuff as we go along. It’s George Orwell’s pigs walking on two legs.

An even better example: a democratic military coup against a democratically elected prime minister! This is pigs hopping on one leg.

Some of us want Thaksin, the kingdom’s prodigal son, to come back and rule. Some of us want Thaksin, the kingdom’s petulant son of a (fill in the blank), to rot on foreign soil for the rest of his life.

Fine, fair enough for both sides, but how do we solve this? We solve this by using the failsafe of democracy, a public referendum.

Ahead of the referendum, the Democrats and the anti-Thaksin can campaign, persuade, propagate and character-assassinate as they please. Likewise, Pheu Thai and the Thaksinistas can campaign, persuade, propagate and character-assassinate as they wish. It’s in the spirit of democracy.

Then, we have it out in the referendum.

Whatever the result, we accept. Why? This is because we are not crying and whining little children, but are educated adults who respect the democratic process and appreciates this democratic failsafe for an issue so contentious and controversial it is driving society further and further apart.

And yes, at the end of it we might have to brace ourselves for his imminent return to power. Indeed, the democratic process may lead to Thaksin becoming prime minister again.

It would be wiser to keep Yingluck Shinawatra as prime minister, but in a clash of wisdom and ego, look for the latter to triumph more often than not, especially for the man in question. But even in this, we the people of Thailand must accept, because we are educated, responsible adults, or at least we should aspire to be.

If Thaksin, as prime minster, corrupts to enrich his clan and cronies; if he exploits power, abuses human rights and threatens freedom of speech, then we march. Not with tanks and troops. Not with sticks and stones, buckets of blood, mysterious men in black, or an arsenal of M79 grenade launchers, but with conviction in the democratic process and the integrity to stand up for it.

For Thai politics to mature, we must take the skywalk. Sure, it takes more time. Of course, it’s more tiring. Yes, it takes patience. But if Thai politics is parents dragging little kids across the street against oncoming cars, then don’t be surprised if and when we all get run over by a bus.
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Re: Ex-Thai PM 'to face murder charge'

Post by Dannie Boy »

That's an excellent article that makes a lot of sense to those of us who have grown up in a true democratic society, well as democratic as you can get these days.

Will the Thai people finally see sense and bite the bullet rather than fire it, we can only hope so, but it could be a big hope!!
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Re: Ex-Thai PM 'to face murder charge'

Post by sargeant »

Cozza good posts and a very good article

the only problem is it is only dealing with TWO sides even if it takes care of PT and PAD it still does not deal with the ninja leader or the dictator

and while i personally think they are spent forces up to a point they will still be in the background stirring even with shortened spoons and ignoring them is something that will be done at everybodies peril
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Re: Ex-Thai PM 'to face murder charge'

Post by cozza »

Interviewing Michael Yon with Khun Nattha on Thai PBS about what he saw during the demonstrations:

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