Some Bangkok Embassies to stop Certification of Income Letters

[Big Boy]

I don't think they will know yet either. They will be as confused as the rest of us - I don't think anybody saw this one coming.

They will state what needs to happen when they have worked it out, and despite several people having unfortunate dealings in the past, I have found that so long as you comply, they do a decent job. We just have to play the waiting game now, and we will hear what our futures hold soon enough.

I have read many solutions to the announcement over the last 24 hours. Almost certainly somebody will have called it right, but a hell of a lot more will have got it wrong.

[musungu]

T.O.M - You are not helpful and not even British but you seem to like making so many comments on which is a very difficult situation for many - please shut up and comment on another topic elsewhere.

[caller]

From another source:

However, the Canadian Embassy in Bangkok on Tuesday told Thaivisa: "there is no plan to change anything related to income letters for the immediate future".

I know the source should not be used but I thought this being very relevant an exception might be made.

Well, nor are the British Embassy until December. But it would be interesting to learn if the reaction of the British Embassy is different to that of others and what the others are doing to get around this preoblem? It's a pity TV didn't think to ask that.

[T.O.M.]

T.O.M - You are not helpful and not even British but you seem to like making so many comments on which is a very difficult situation for many - please shut up and comment on another topic elsewhere.

Having a bad hair day?
We are all second guessing at the moment....I don't see in what way my posts are better/worse than anyone else's?
"which is a very difficult situation for many"....Being a drama queen here....I am certain immigration won't start kicking people out after the UK embassy stops issuing income letters. Sure there will be a satisfactory solution for everyone.
And finally.....oh the irony...."and not even British"......coming from another non-Brit.

[HHTel]

A statement from the British Embassy:

The decision was made by the British Embassy following a meeting with immigration in May in which they confirmed that they expect the embassy to verify all sources of income of British Nationals requesting an income letter. Consular officers are not verification experts and therefore cannot fulfil (sic) this requirement. We also cannot verify income from every income source in every country of the world. Thai Immigration is able to verify the income in a Thai bank account, therefore British Nationals should show evidence of minimum funds for their visa type by showing a Thai bank statement and/or bank book. This is not a new requirement and has always been an option for foreigners renewing retirement and marriage visas in Thailand".



Regarding the way forward the British Embassy Bangkok told



"British Nationals should now demonstrate that they have an amount of at least 800,000 THB in an account in Thailand for no less than three months prior to the visa application, or a monthly income of at least 65,000 THB transferred into an account in Thailand for a retirement visa. For a marriage visa, the amounts are at least 400,000 THB in an account in Thailand for no less than three months prior to the visa application, or a monthly income of at least 40,000 THB transferred into an account in Thailand. A bank statement should be used as the supporting document for obtaining a Thai retirement or marriage visa. If the British National doesn’t already have a bank account, they should open one and follow the steps above".

Asked if they were aware of action by other embassies the British Embassy Bangkok said:

"Yes we are aware that the US embassy will also be stopping their notarised income letter. Please contact them directly for further information".

So far it seems that the Canadian, New Zealand and Netherlands embassies have said there is no change.

"There is no change to the New Zealand Embassy’s current process. New Zealand nationals are welcome to visit the Embassy to complete a statutory declaration - and declare their income."

New Zealand issue a signed affidavit similar to the US Embassy.

It appears that the British Embassy is doing this off their own back after a meeting with Thai Immigration.

[Big Boy]

Thank you HHTel. That at least gives the reason for the action.

It is still a grey area regarding showing of monthly income i.e. will my 2 £10K transfers each year suffice, or does it have to be transferred each month, which I won't do? I guess it'll all become clear soon.

[T.O.M.]

Thank you HHTel. That at least gives the reason for the action.

It is still a grey area regarding showing of monthly income i.e. will my 2 £10K transfers each year suffice, or does it have to be transferred each month, which I won't do? I guess it'll all become clear soon.

HHTel's post says "A monthly income transferred into a Thai bank account"...
I guess that means the money will have to be transferred monthly?
In your case, why not go the the marriage-visa route...?
Time one of your transfers so it enters your account 3 months prior to your extension and don't spend it before your visit to immigration.....More work for immigration (marriage visa) and easier for you. No monthly transfers needed, and when you have your 2 yearly transfers scheduled to fit your new visa...much easier for you.

[Big Boy]

Yes, that is my intention, or Plan B if they don't come up with a better way of verifying my income. Crazy, because I easily qualify, but reading HHTel's bit, the Brits are suffering because other nations can easily cheat the system:

Asked if they were aware of action by other embassies the British Embassy Bangkok said:

"Yes we are aware that the US embassy will also be stopping their notarised income letter. Please contact them directly for further information".

So far it seems that the Canadian, New Zealand and Netherlands embassies have said there is no change.

"There is no change to the New Zealand Embassy’s current process. New Zealand nationals are welcome to visit the Embassy to complete a statutory declaration - and declare their income."

New Zealand issue a signed affidavit similar to the US Embassy.

Having said that, I provided genuine proof of my income, but, if the British Embassy were simply believing my statement, without checking validity, I guess there could also have been Brits providing incorrect evidence.

As usual, the genuine people are suffering because of the scam merchants

[caller]

Just because New Zealand and other Embassies have said they will continue to notarise their citizens income, doesn't mean that Thai immigration will accept such letters on their own anymore, judging by what they are now expecting the British Embassy to do and assuming they face the same problem of being able to verify such income. I think it would be worth finding out from Thai immigration first, that such letters will continue to be accepted as proof of income or not?

Interesting that the Brit Embassy were confident enough to say the Americans would also be cancelling the service they provide as well.

I was also interested to learn that showing 65k going into your Thai account each month was always an option for demonstrating income, whereas I had always believed you had to go the Embassy route?

[Big Boy]

I was also interested to learn that showing 65k going into your Thai account each month was always an option for demonstrating income, whereas I had always believed you had to go the Embassy route?

It actually states that in one of the Thai links I shared above. I wasn't aware either.

[STEVE G]

Thank you HHTel. That at least gives the reason for the action.

It is still a grey area regarding showing of monthly income i.e. will my 2 £10K transfers each year suffice, or does it have to be transferred each month, which I won't do? I guess it'll all become clear soon.

Just a small point BB, if you used someone like TransferWise, it wouldn't cost anymore to send money every month than it would do to send it twice a year as the costs are on a percentage basis.
I send money to Thailand every month to pay for my household expenses, even though I'm not retired yet.

[lomuamart]

I've looked back through the posts and am not sure which link you're referring to, BB. AFAIA, the option of transferring 65K/40K to a Thai bank account every month has never been an option before to prove income. Imm wanted Embassy letters and that was that. I've not seen that option quoted anywhere before. I stand to be corrected but the only link that I see is in Thai.
I have been asked to bring income into Thailand before but that was years ago when trying to get a marriage extension (I wasn't yet 50 at the time). The officer told me that they wanted to see an Embassy letter but also proof that 40K min was being transferred to a Thai account. I pointed out that that wasn't the law and was told that they wanted both in HH. In fact, the reason they wanted the transfers was to try and put me off going for the marriage extension as I had sufficient income for retirement but was 8 months away from turning 50. We found a way around it that required me to get non Imm O visas from Penang until I turned 50 and then the income letter was all that was needed for the retirement extension.
Other than that aside, it just strikes me as strange that the British Embassy have been told to verify income when they were one of the few Embassies who asked for original proof of income. Other Embassies are still saying that they'll issue letters on the basis of statutory declarations without any proof. Maybe Imm just haven't got around to them?
As far as you're concerned, BB the law has always been that the 65K must be average income over the year so if that isn't changed your 2 transfers a year could still be OK. It's just the way you bring money over. It'll depend on wording and how it's interpreted.
Personally, I don't have a problem with bringing over 65K a month. I already bring more than that. I'll just have to remember to update my bank book to show the monthly transfers rather than doing so maybe every 6 months and having all the income lumped together. Or maybe I can get bank statements from Kasikorn? Must admit that I try and go into the bank as little as possible and don't know the half of what they can provide.
But if Imm just plump for 800K savings, like many I'll probably revert to marriage extensions.
Despite what the British Embassy are saying about transferring the 65K monthly, I'll wait for an announcement from Imm as the definitive version. I'm glad I did my extension last month.

[PeteC]

Two things strike out at me about all of this.

1) That most of the world apparently thinks that taking an oath and swearing to something is worthless, and perhaps the majority are now lying? Let's strike integrity from the dictionaries and make it an extinct word.

2) In this age of e-economy and cashless societies, which the Thai government is pushing continuously everyday, they apparently won't accept proof of funds in a bank anywhere with electronic access to them from here. Of course their lack of sophistication dictates that a Thai bank which pays little to no interest and generates fees for the bank must be used.

If these types of conditions (including all the 24 hour and 90 day reporting) was demanded of Thai non-citizen residents of any western country there would be mob protests in the streets in front of the applicable government buildings, and the funny thing is that they would be listened to, their concerns addressed, and regulations amended if found discriminatory and an undue burden. Silly me for thinking these people care about fairness and undue burdens. Pete

[Big Boy]

I've looked back through the posts and am not sure which link you're referring to, BB.

I was referring to this link https://www.immigration.go.th/content/service_22 , which translates (according to Bing, so maybe not accurate) as:

1. Aliens must be inspected. Temporary people

2. They are 50 years old or older.

3. Is there evidence of money not less than 65,000 baht per month?

4. As of the date of submission of the request, there are deposits in the bank in Thailand. The savings account is normal in the account for the past 3 months not less than 800, 000 Baht only in the first year to show the account.
Deposit with the amount deposited in the account.
Not less than 60 days?

5. Have money in a year And have a bank deposit. Calculate at least 800,000 baht,
up to the date of application.

6. Foreigners who entered the Kingdom before 21 October 1998
and were allowed to stay in the Kingdom. To live in the end continuity.
The following rules apply:
(a) Age of 60 years or over and a fixed income with a fixed deposit in the account. The minimum period of 3 months is 2000,000 baht
or less than 20,000 baht per month.
(B) The age is less than 60 years but not less than 55 years. Remain in For a period of 3 months
at least 500,000 per year or income of not less than 50,000 baht a month.

[lomuamart]

Thanks. It's not very clear but doesn't seem to me to indicate transfers of 65K+ will be accepted as income. If you're referring to point 4, I think that just refers to savings again with the 800K having to be in the bank for 3 months in the first year and 60 days thereafter (which is back to front anyway although we know HH want 3 months at all times - it could just be bad punctuation).
As said before, AFAIA all applications for retirement or marriage extensions based on income have to be supported by an income verification letter from your Embassy.
Of course that might change now but it seems somewhat presumptuous of the Brit Emb to say it will before it's been confirmed by Imm. It's further presumptuous of them to say that the US Emb will do away with the letters when they themselves haven't made any such announcement (yet).