STEVE G wrote: ↑Fri Jul 30, 2021 10:39 pm
I think the only real problem with Hydrogen is that the infrastructure hasn't been developed. If a network of production and distribution facilities had been put into place starting from about ten years ago, it might now look more viable.
Electricity for battery cars is already manufactured and delivered worldwide and the facilities already exist.
https://www.nationalgrid.com/stories/jo ... ctric-cars
"There is definitely enough energy and the grid can cope easily,” he explains. “The growth in renewable energy means this is not static and smart metering will make this more efficient. For example, the growth in wind power from the extra offshore wind farms being developed will adequately meet the future demand for electrifying transport – an extra 100 terrawatt hours from our current 300 terrawatt hours consumed.
Yes they can supply the electricity where to? Many people have to park on roads, if they are lucky outside their own house. So in the area I live in could be 200 yards away. The flats I live in we, have a parking space about 25 yards from the nearest electricity point. Who is going to pay to put charging points in, who ever the the bill it will be expensive.
Garages will not be able to cope takes 5-10 minutes to fill a car with petrol and there is usually a queue.
As I have said they are living in a dream world.
Woke up this morning breathing that's a good start to the day.
STEVE G wrote: ↑Fri Jul 30, 2021 10:39 pm
I think the only real problem with Hydrogen is that the infrastructure hasn't been developed.
And how has it been for electric cars (i.e. charging) in the UK and many other countries? As mentioned in a previous post, Bio Fuels and the likes of HVO require virtually zero changes to existing cars, or infrastructure - no exhaustive mining of Lithium and no disposal problems of defunct batteries (after how many years?). What happens to those existing CE cars currently on the roads numbering in the billions (not just UK obviously)? How is that waste disposed of in such a short timescale?
Dannie Boy wrote: ↑Fri Jul 30, 2021 10:08 pm
There are so many issues here it’s difficult to know where to start, but top of most people’s agenda is the realization that global warming is accepted by the majority as the number one risk that’s needs to be tackled now - if not then the world is heading towards disaster.
Indeed - but the introduction of electric vehicles doesn't combat the environmental impact on the production of electricity. I'm speaking from a UK point of view where we have a lot to do with regards to "Environmentally Friendly" production of electricity - far more investment into "Tidal Production" needs to be done for example. Production of electricity has admirably been dramatically reduced - unfortunately, not a hell of a lot has been done to replace that production. Red tape and the usual bureaucracy/political BS has well, you know... The consequences of this (aside from a shitload of jobs being lost) is that the UK's "Grid" will not cope.
There are numerous reports from around the world that fossil fuel consumption will indeed increase over the coming years.....
Hey, I'm all good for electric vehicles, but the UK for one is pushing for them before we can cope - all alternatives need to be looked at.
"Hope is a good thing, maybe the best of things" - Yma o Hyd.
lindosfan1 wrote: ↑Sat Jul 31, 2021 12:02 am
Yes they can supply the electricity where to? Many people have to park on roads, if they are lucky outside their own house. So in the area I live in could be 200 yards away. The flats I live in we, have a parking space about 25 yards from the nearest electricity point. Who is going to pay to put charging points in, who ever the the bill it will be expensive.
Yep - very valid point. I'm lucky enough to have off road parking, but am certainly in the minority in my street/area. No places are guaranteed, so charging vehicles at home is not an option. The local Tesco has 4 charging points though !!
Last edited by pharvey on Sat Jul 31, 2021 12:38 am, edited 1 time in total.
"Hope is a good thing, maybe the best of things" - Yma o Hyd.
Europe delivers blow to Asia with $47B investment in EV battery gigafactories
"As of May 2021, 38 battery cell gigafactories are being built or planned in Europe and the UK, according to the latest report by the non-governmental organization Transport & Environment.
Out of the 38 projects, 17 have secured funding so far, estimated to be up to $30 billion between them. The amount consists of both private and public funding, including, for instance, Tesla’s gigafactory in Berlin, which received $1.4 billion in German federal and state support."
Porsche Taycan Beats Electric Cross-Country Cannonball Record
"Last week, Conner crossed the US in a Porsche Taycan 4S in just 44 hours and 25 minutes."
That's for about 4500km including charging, it's possible because cars like that can charge from 20% to 80% in about 20 minutes on a fast charger, so with a 20 minute break every couple of hundred km, you can drive for ever.
Looks like it. I wish I had taken a photo, but I didn't know it was electric initially, and I wasn't going to photograph it with the owner talking to me.
Steve I also read about 2 months ago about Vietnams EV ambitions. They are building out charging station infrastructure in Vietnam at a rapid pace, and Vietnam is home to one of the world's leading EV manufacturers believe it or not.
Some of these developing nations just skip past all our Western history and begin with the current technology.
Europe delivers blow to Asia with $47B investment in EV battery gigafactories
"As of May 2021, 38 battery cell gigafactories are being built or planned in Europe and the UK, according to the latest report by the non-governmental organization Transport & Environment.
Out of the 38 projects, 17 have secured funding so far, estimated to be up to $30 billion between them. The amount consists of both private and public funding, including, for instance, Tesla’s gigafactory in Berlin, which received $1.4 billion in German federal and state support."
Yep, all great, huge investment, jobs et al - but my concern is where is the infrastructure and how is the electricity produced to actually charge these wonderful "Gigafactory Produced Batteries"?
"Hope is a good thing, maybe the best of things" - Yma o Hyd.
Europe delivers blow to Asia with $47B investment in EV battery gigafactories
"As of May 2021, 38 battery cell gigafactories are being built or planned in Europe and the UK, according to the latest report by the non-governmental organization Transport & Environment.
Out of the 38 projects, 17 have secured funding so far, estimated to be up to $30 billion between them. The amount consists of both private and public funding, including, for instance, Tesla’s gigafactory in Berlin, which received $1.4 billion in German federal and state support."
Yep, all great, huge investment, jobs et al - but my concern is where is the infrastructure and how is the electricity produced to actually charge these wonderful "Gigafactory Produced Batteries"?
Electricity companies sell electricity, when has increased demand ever been a problem for people who sell things?
lindosfan1 wrote: ↑Sat Jul 31, 2021 1:16 pm
New problem now, hackers getting into electric cars charging. Knowing how evil some hackers could be is a worry, will it ever be secure.
In the analogue world, I can play a drum and hear the sound, in the digital world, if the electricity goes off, all I have are a bunch of soft plastic pads.
lindosfan1 wrote: ↑Sat Jul 31, 2021 1:16 pm
New problem now, hackers getting into electric cars charging. Knowing how evil some hackers could be is a worry, will it ever be secure.
In the analogue world, I can play a drum and hear the sound, in the digital world, if the electricity goes off, all I have are a bunch of soft plastic pads.
Exactly how secure is your car. These hackers and thieves are very clever.
Woke up this morning breathing that's a good start to the day.
STEVE G wrote: ↑Sat Jul 31, 2021 1:42 pm
Electricity companies sell electricity, when has increased demand ever been a problem for people who sell things?
Please understand that I'm referring more towards the UK (but would assume other countries may well have the same issue).
Increased demand is not an issue as long as you can cover that demand. The UK has significantly reduced the generation of electricity through the use of fossil fuels, but the concern is that they have not done enough to replace this in a timely manner. The likes of Hinkley Point C is running behind schedule (and over budget) and also strong rumours further delays likely.
There are realistic concerns that the UK Grid will simply not handle the expected increase in demand. We are not moving fast enough.
"Hope is a good thing, maybe the best of things" - Yma o Hyd.
STEVE G wrote: ↑Sat Jul 31, 2021 1:42 pm
Electricity companies sell electricity, when has increased demand ever been a problem for people who sell things?
Please understand that I'm referring more towards the UK (but would assume other countries may well have the same issue).
Increased demand is not an issue as long as you can cover that demand. The UK has significantly reduced the generation of electricity through the use of fossil fuels, but the concern is that they have not done enough to replace this in a timely manner. The likes of Hinkley Point C is running behind schedule (and over budget) and also strong rumours further delays likely.
There are realistic concerns that the UK Grid will simply not handle the expected increase in demand. We are not moving fast enough.
The have just closed Dungeness B 14 years early
Woke up this morning breathing that's a good start to the day.
STEVE G wrote: ↑Sat Jul 31, 2021 1:42 pm
Electricity companies sell electricity, when has increased demand ever been a problem for people who sell things?
Please understand that I'm referring more towards the UK (but would assume other countries may well have the same issue).
Increased demand is not an issue as long as you can cover that demand. The UK has significantly reduced the generation of electricity through the use of fossil fuels, but the concern is that they have not done enough to replace this in a timely manner. The likes of Hinkley Point C is running behind schedule (and over budget) and also strong rumours further delays likely.
There are realistic concerns that the UK Grid will simply not handle the expected increase in demand. We are not moving fast enough.
The have just closed Dungeness B 14 years early
My point exactly
"Hope is a good thing, maybe the best of things" - Yma o Hyd.
Please understand that I'm referring more towards the UK (but would assume other countries may well have the same issue).
Increased demand is not an issue as long as you can cover that demand. The UK has significantly reduced the generation of electricity through the use of fossil fuels, but the concern is that they have not done enough to replace this in a timely manner. The likes of Hinkley Point C is running behind schedule (and over budget) and also strong rumours further delays likely.
There are realistic concerns that the UK Grid will simply not handle the expected increase in demand. We are not moving fast enough.
The have just closed Dungeness B 14 years early
My point exactly
We’re starting to drift away from electric cars but as a former employee of the CEGB who initially operated Dungeness B (a plant I visited a number of times), it was initially built with a lifespan to only 2005. This was subsequently extended until 2018 and then again until 2028, but following corrosion problems in the reactor, it was decided to close it earlier, but in total it ran for 35 years - far longer than it’s original design life.
But as others have pointed out - huge investment continues in renewable energy, particularly wind farms which in 2020 produced a quarter of the UK’s electricity needs - this number will continue to grow. This growth is almost certainly going to meet the needs of increased energy from the proliferation of EV’s, so I don’t think that’s a significant concern - the problem is with the charging infrastructure that will be lagging, unless and until this issue is addressed.
!!
- but my concern is where is the infrastructure and how is the electricity produced to actually charge these wonderful "Gigafactory Produced Batteries"?
