Pattaya - Hua Hin Ferry

[Super Joe]

Their website says operations will commence in October 2009, but is 'still under construction'. I'd at least be filling it up with pictures of the boat, Pattaya, HH & Cha Am 'attractions/things to do' pages etc!?
They've got the boat now so it must be given a go to see if works business wise. Think Steve might have hit the nail about docking.
Their website says they're looking for ticketing partners, anyone seen anything in HH about buying a ticket for October ?
Hope it works out though, even if it ends up a bit delayed as is par for the course here.
SJ

[Lung Per]

Will this boat have a seaworthiness certificate and if so, issued by whom? The Thai autorities? Will it be approved and classified for insurance purposes by a responsible and trustworthy maritime ageny such as Norske Veritas or Lloyds of London?
If not, let them just carry all the Ruskies they want - I ain't going....

[Wanderlust]

Lung Per,
Does that mean that you won't use any passenger transportation in Thailand, as I am sure all of them would have been issued with the relevant licences by the Thai authorities? Trains, buses, minibuses, tuk tuks, taxis and even planes should be ruled out by your pathetic statement - give these guys a break; they are trying to put a business together and have spent at least two years to get to the point where they are now, which as far as we know is testing the boat.

Everyone,
I have no involvement in the project and don't know the people in question but at least let them get underway before making negative comments! Nobody on here knows enough about what they are doing, have done or will do to be able to do anything but guess.

[STEVE G]

Exactly WL, I'm pretty sure that the motor-bike taxis opposite the end of Bintabaht are not certified by Lloyds of London either, or the samlors from the station come to that.
I'm sure an operation like this will have to meet Thai regulations.

[f0xxee]

Actually Lung per has a valid point. Sorry gents, but if you fly Thai Air you expect T.A to conform to international conventions such as IATA etc etc. Would you really fly with an airline that didn't? So why get on a boat? The ocean is as hostile as the sky... it just has further variables to kill you.

With passenger craft (in fact any registered vessel) there are SOLAS regulations (Thank the Titanic disaster) which is Safety of Life at Sea, which is a series of international coventions covering everything from stability (intact and damaged) structure and construction, load line, safety, radio, standards of Certification for watchkeepers etc etc etc. These may be internationally enforced, or, if the vessel is not involved on international voyages, by the state where the state is a member of the IMO (international Maritime Organisation). Thailand is a member state.

These conventions are hard won for a reason: Shipping has long been a bastion of the Lone Wolf capitalist with small concience and a PO Box in the Bahamas.

I do feel qualified to make a few educated guesses. And I am not a nay-sayer, if I thought this was feasible I would promote it with equal vigour.
Sorry, this does not float my boat.

If they cover the safety and survey requirements (This is where Lloyds, ABS, DNV etc come in) and then maintain the boat and train the crew to the standard required as per International Conventions (and bet your ass if they plan to flog tickets out of any Multinational hotel or agency they will have to) they are looking at very hefty overheads. Profit margins?
Negligible.

And I am not trying to burst thier bubble either: I have been following this story from the Pattaya end since day 1 (2 years ago) as I have a professional interest and I cannot for the life of me figure out how they are going to make this service profitiable.

Convince me otherwise, and I'll happily talk it up: But the website originally had this baby launched and loaded 2 years ago, 1 year ago, 4 months ago and now in October. And they still dont have agents, a website, any discernible marketing that I can see, and last time I looked, a crew. (I might be wrong on the crew.)

No, when this does happen it will not be as a sole proprietor: it will be by a dedicated ferry operator from Aus or Europe (hopefully not the Philippines) who can absorb losses for a few years while the market is established.

[PeteC]

Fox, the 2-1 year ago I think was a totally different company who started with a van service to and fro, promising a ferry later on. Their name is on here somewhere, probably in this same thread. My understanding is that the owner simply disappeared one day. I believe this new outfit has nothing to do with them and only recently completed the construction of their ship(s).

If we're going to talk about this new outfit, we need to talk about the existing ferry services Suratani>Kou Samui and Phuket>Phi Phi Yai as well. Not short trips and many operators in existence for years. Yes, some accidents as well.

My assumption is that this new service will be certified in the same way these existing operators are certified, which I don't think are to the standards you mention above. It's then a 'passenger choice' issue, as they'll never decertify anyone here barring a huge catastrophe. Pete

[PeteC]

...If they cover the safety and survey requirements (This is where Lloyds, ABS, DNV etc come in) and then maintain the boat and train the crew to the standard required as per International Conventions (and bet your ass if they plan to flog tickets out of any Multinational hotel or agency they will have to) they are looking at very hefty overheads. Profit margins?
Negligible.

Sorry, missed this aspect. It's incorrect. Tour desks and agencies in almost all hotels in this country, regardless of stars, are sublet businesses and not run or policed by the hotels themselves. The hotel concierge will walk a guest over to them with a smile, as he'll get a commission.

I'm not saying any of this is proper, just mentioning how things are. Pete

[f0xxee]

Hi Pete,

I think it has been the same dudes all the way along. Can I post the link to thier website here?

I Guess the Mods will soon yank my chain if its the wrong thing to do....

It should be a simple matter to find out what classification (if any) the Koh Samui and Phi Phi island ferry's are.

I am betting they do actually confirm to SOLAS, although probably would not pass close scrutiny, but come close enough. Enough liferafts and Lifejackets, etc etc.

The Thai's god bless 'em took the British model for most things, and I belive that includes things maritime. I might pop down and have a wee look just out of interest.

Re: Miultinational agents. Yes I guess you are right there too... But I am seeing changes coming: Thailand is slowly being drawn into the global net of rules and conventions. Whether that is for the best or not I can't say.

Cheers!

[STEVE G]

Yes, if you're talking about Thai maritime safety in it's entirety that is fair enough, but thousands of Western tourists already use ferries to get to many Thai destinations and I don't see why this one is any different and it looks safer than those longtail boats often used around the region.
Obviously commercial viability is another issue, but that is up to the owners and not the passengers main concern.

[f0xxee]

Hi Steve G,

I guess the point I am making is that safety and certification is ridiculously expensive and that if this is a Falang run enterprise I would be surprised if they didn't make a real effort to make the vessel conform to relevant regulations.... and that is prohibitively expensive for a sole-operator.
Hence my comments that I thought it was could not be profitable for several years.

I would like to see it happen. I would like to see it happen safely.

I guess like doctors make the worst patients and Mechanics have shit box cars, sea dogs don't like going on OPB's. (Other Peoples Boats.)

[PeteC]

Hi Pete,

I think it has been the same dudes all the way along. Can I post the link to thier website here? .....

They're not a competitor to any HHAD advertiser to my knowledge, not Hua Hin based, and this is a subject of interest on here. However, I don't think you can post a link until you get more posts. Try it anyway and see if it works. If not, BC the link to me. Pete

[f0xxee]

Hi,

You are right, I am a newbie scum. Cannae post it.

Try thailivingferry with the apropriate dots and com's etc.

cheers,

[Lung Per]

Lung Per,
Does that mean that you won't use any passenger transportation in Thailand, as I am sure all of them would have been issued with the relevant licences by the Thai authorities? Trains, buses, minibuses, tuk tuks, taxis and even planes should be ruled out by your pathetic statement - give these guys a break; they are trying to put a business together and have spent at least two years to get to the point where they are now, which as far as we know is testing the boat.

Everyone,
I have no involvement in the project and don't know the people in question but at least let them get underway before making negative comments! Nobody on here knows enough about what they are doing, have done or will do to be able to do anything but guess.

Wanderlust, it should come as no surprise to you that the transportation accident rate in this part of the world is much higher than that of the western world. One of the main reasons for the relatively low accident rate in Europe and the US is the stringent set of safety regulations that encompass the transportation business being it by land, sea or air.
With the scarce facts made available on the subject project it seems to me that we have here a couple of adventurous entrepreneurs, eager to build a boat, but apparently, repeat apparently, without basic knowledge of the mechanisms that are involved in running a boat service. Henceforth my questions about certification and my reluctance to trust them with my life. I may of course be wrong and they may very well have everything under control, but so far we have no information to that effect. And as far as your analysis of my "pathetic" statement goes, yes, I am continuosly and with good reason concerned about the safety of Thai buses, vans, tuk-tuks, etc. I always look the driver into his eyes to see if he is under influence before entering his vehicle. Also, is the vehicle held together by gaffa tape, I do not enter. Common sense is always No. 1.

[Big Boy]

Hi Pete,

I think it has been the same dudes all the way along. Can I post the link to thier website here? .....

They're not a competitor to any HHAD advertiser to my knowledge, not Hua Hin based, and this is a subject of interest on here. However, I don't think you can post a link until you get more posts. Try it anyway and see if it works. If not, BC the link to me. Pete

You beat me to it this time Pete

f0xxee, on the face of it I don't see any problem with you posting the link.

[PeteC]

Here's the first post of the thread Fox going back to Jan 2007 with the name of the initial company. Below is the new link. Doesn't give any detail at all really as to who is behind it. Pete

http://www.thailivingferry.com/index.html

From the Pattaya Mail newspaper today. Pete
_____________________________

Stormbringer introduce direct Hua Hin service

Not too long ago, three friends were sitting in a bar in Pattaya and talking of how to get to Hua Hin for a golfing trip when they realized that there was no direct service between the two locations.
With this in mind they decided to form Stormbringer Charters, which is now operating a direct minibus service and as of the 15th of February a direct air service linking up with SGA’s Bangkok-Hua Hin scheduled flights.
Starting at the beginning of March they will also launch a high-speed ferry service doing the crossing from Pattaya to Hua Hin in a blistering 2 hours. This will present passengers with aircraft type seating for up to 25 people and a hostess service offering drinks and snacks. The pick up point will be from Bali Hai pier in Pattaya and a free shuttle bus will meet the boat at Pak Nam Pran Marina to transfer passengers to Hua Hin. It is planned to offer two trips a day from Pattaya, departing at 9am and 4pm respectively. The return journeys will be at 6am and 1pm.
As mentioned, Stormbringer Charters are also currently running a minibus service to Hua Hin which departs twice daily at 6am and 12 noon from Jomtien, Second Rd and Dolphin Roundabout. The minibuses are new and can carry golf clubs and luggage etc in the trailer. The fare one-way is 450 Baht and the trip takes 4hrs with a 10min stop halfway.
The air service takes 30mins; they fly twice a day and prices and schedules are available on request.
In all the services offered provide a safe and hassle free transfer between these two major holiday destinations.