History Challenge & Journal

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Nereus
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Re: History Challenge & Journal

Post by Nereus »

lindosfan1 wrote: Thu Nov 14, 2019 6:49 pm The surrounds could be to a church door, a guess Westminster abbey.
The oldest door in Britain in Westminster Abbey - a 900-year-old door was put in place in the 1050s, during the reign of the Abbey’s founder, Edward the Confessor. The door, which measures 6.5ft by 4ft, was made from one tree which probably grew between AD 924 and...………..

Reputedly Britain's oldest door, located within Westminster Abbey and put in place by Edward the Confessor. It has been dated to the so when it was first walked through the Norman Conquest hadn't yet happened. Courtesy of British Medieval History.


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Re: History Challenge & Journal

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Yes, Lindosfan is correct. :clap:

Here's the story directly from the Westminster Abbey website: https://www.westminster-abbey.org/abbey ... ldest-door

The oldest door in Britain was identified and dated for the first time at Westminster Abbey, in August 2005.

It is the only surviving Anglo Saxon door in this country, dating back to the time of Edward the Confessor, the Abbeys founder, who was born 1,000 years ago this same year.

This oak door opens from the Abbey Cloisters into to the octagonal Chapter House outer vestibule, where monks met every day for prayers back in the thirteenth century and Parliament temporarily resided in the fourteenth century, before they transferred to the Palace of Westminster. After having been a repository for government records from the 1540s, it was restored in Victorian times by Sir Gilbert Scott.

The dating
The first detailed archaeological study of the door has now taken place, coupled with scientific dating of the timber by a process known as dendrochronology. The latter was carried out by Daniel Miles and Dr Martin Bridge of Oxford Dendrochronology Laboratory.

The door is made of five vertical oak planks, held together with three horizontal battens, or ledges, and iron straps. Most unusually, the battens are recessed into the planks, so that the door is flush on both faces. Normally, medieval doors have a flat front face and a back which has projecting ledges and braces. The construction of the Westminster door is unique, and shows that it was intended to communicate between two spaces of equal importance.

The boards were cut from a single tree and the visible rings on them represent growth during the years from AD 924 to 1030. Because the bark and some of the sapwood was trimmed away when the planks were made into a door, the exact year of felling cannot be determined, but it can be calculated as falling within the period 1032-1064. A date in the 1050s for the manufacture of the door is most likely.

Explains Daniel Miles:

In this way, not only is this the oldest door in Britain, but it is the only one assignable to the Anglo-Saxon period. We can therefore say, confidently, that this was a major door belonging to the great Abbey constructed by Edward the Confessor, King of England, 1042-1065.

The ring-pattern displayed by the timber indicates that the tree grew in eastern England, and almost certainly came from the extensive woodland owned by the Abbey, possibly in Essex.

The door now measures 6½ ft high by 4 ft wide, but has been cut down. Almost certainly the top was originally round-arched, and the door would have measured 9 ft high by 4½ ft wide. After the planks were fitted together, at least one and probably both faces were covered with animal hides, which were tacked on to the planks. The hides were taken from cows and added to provide a smooth surface for decoration. Then the ornamental iron hinges and decorative straps with curled ends were fixed, using large-headed nails and clench-bolts.

Only one of the original iron straps survives today (with skin trapped underneath it), but the outlines of the lost elements have been recovered by studying the fixing-holes and other scars remaining on one face of the door. Except for the paint, its original appearance can thus be reconstructed with confidence. Hitherto, such doors have only been known from drawings in Anglo-Saxon manuscripts, and from later Norman derivatives.

Says Mr Miles:

From its size, and its double-sided form, it is clear that this was one of the major doors of the Saxon Abbey. Its re-use here, in c. 1250, in the Vestibule of King Henry IIIs magnificent Chapter House, can't have been accidental. Henry greatly revered Edward the Confessor, rebuilding the Abbey church and creating a sumptuous shrine in his honour. No expense was spared, and thus the adaptation and re-use of this ancient door must have been a symbolic act to preserve in-use a ritually important element of the Saxon Abbey. Potentially, it was the door to the Confessors own Chapter House.

History and construction

It has long been obvious that the battered and insignificant-looking wooden door leading from the Chapter House Vestibule into a small chamber within the east cloister range of Westminster Abbey must be ancient, but its true age has hitherto eluded discovery. In the 19th century it was noticed that there were fragments of hide adhering to the door, and a legend grew up suggesting that these were human. It was supposed that somebody in the Middle Ages had been caught committing sacrilege in the Abbey, had been flayed and his skin nailed to the door as a deterrent to other would-be felons. A specific link was suggested to a robbery that is known to have taken place in the adjoining treasury, in 1303.
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Re: History Challenge & Journal

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And a quick search of google....

#2 Entry door of the Parish Church of St. Botolph
Country: The UK
Age: Around 1000 years

In the small town of Hadstock, in the county of Essex, there is a church – the Parish Church of St. Botolph. In spite of its size and the lack of tourists, the town is home to one of the oldest doors in the United Kingdom. An interesting fact to point out is that the door is still, to this day, in use!

In 2003, two Oxford scientists took samples from the door in an attempt to date it more accurately. The large oak door was lifted off its hinges and carefully laid on the church’s pews. The scientists took four samples and hang the door back on its hinges on the same day. The results from the tests made showed that the door was constructed between 1040 and 1070, confirming the hypothesis that this was the oldest door in the United Kingdom.

#3 The oak door at the Westminster Abbey
Country: The UK
Age: Around 900 years


The second oldest door in the United Kingdom was dated for the first time in August 2005. It is located at the Westminster Abbey. This is the only Anglo-saxon door remaining in the UK. The door dates as far back as the reign of Edward the Confessor; among the last Anglo-saxon kings of England and founder of the Abbey, born in 1003 AD. Scientists believe that the door is so well preserved today because it is inside the Abbey. It is also constantly in use, which entails some maintenance.

The first thorough archaeological study of the door was performed alongside a scientific dating of the door. A method known as dendrochronology was employed for the purpose. The dating of the door was carried out by scientists from a laboratory in Oxford. They came to the conclusion that the boards used in the construction of the door were made of wood that grew in 924-1030 AD. Because the bark and the sapwood were stripped down, the precise year the tree was cut down could not be established. According to scientists, however, it is likely that the tree was cut down somewhere between 1032 and 1064. The door itself was constructed in the 1050s.

The wooden door is made of five vertical oak boards, held together with three horizontal planks and iron bands. The most unusual thing about the way this wooden door was made are the canals milled into the vertical boards. The horizontal boards in turn are fitted in these milled canals. That way the door appears smooth on both sides. Usually, doors in that period were constructed with a smooth front. The backside of the door, on the other hand, showed the horizontal rails and iron bands, holding the vertical wooden boards together. The construction of the oak door at the Westminster Abbey is truly unique. It shows that it was made to connect two equally important interior spaces.

https://sbsdesign.bg/the-oldest-preserv ... the-world/
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Re: History Challenge & Journal

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What is the name of a Baron that fought at Waterloo and now has descendants that call pharvey a neighbor?
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Re: History Challenge & Journal

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Nereus wrote: Sat Feb 08, 2020 5:52 pm What is the name of a Baron that fought at Waterloo and now has descendants that call pharvey a neighbor?

Now that's frightening!

[EDIT] Without searching, think I have an idea - famous family obviously, Banker?
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Re: History Challenge & Journal

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pharvey wrote: Sun Feb 09, 2020 2:34 am Purchased this recently, so expect some questions!!

Can't show the JPEG, so look at the link! Cracking book: -

And hey, if I post questions, you're not allowed to revise!!

:cheers: :cheers:
Seems I can't even post the link!!



Again, link not happening!! Take a look at History: From the Dawn of Civilization to the Present Day. What's happening HHF??!!
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Re: History Challenge & Journal

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https://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/0241201306/ ... 0241201306

61PvxNkUYnL._SX418_BO1,204,203,200_.jpg
61PvxNkUYnL._SX418_BO1,204,203,200_.jpg (70.41 KiB) Viewed 255 times

You needed to use the URL button in this case, just like with BBC links. Regardless, if you click on your Amazon images in your post it takes you there. :cheers:
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Re: History Challenge & Journal

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^ Cheers Pete :thumb: IQ level had been diluted by cider :oops:
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Re: History Challenge & Journal

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pharvey wrote: Sun Feb 09, 2020 2:17 am
Nereus wrote: Sat Feb 08, 2020 5:52 pm What is the name of a Baron that fought at Waterloo and now has descendants that call pharvey a neighbor?
[EDIT] Without searching, think I have an idea - famous family obviously, Banker?
With searching, I think I have a better idea 8) - Baron Raglan, who lost his right arm at Waterloo. The family seat is in Monmouthshire.
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Re: History Challenge & Journal

Post by dtaai-maai »

Have a guess at these for now...

1. What are the ceremonial counties of England (I want a definition, not a list!) and...

2. how do they differ from the metropolitan and non-metropolitan counties?

3. Why do Essex, Kent and Cornwall (for example) not have the suffix '-shire'?
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Re: History Challenge & Journal

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1. Something to do with a Lord Lieutenant?
2. Not having the above?
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Re: History Challenge & Journal

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dtaai-maai wrote: Mon Feb 10, 2020 2:53 am
pharvey wrote: Sun Feb 09, 2020 2:17 am
Nereus wrote: Sat Feb 08, 2020 5:52 pm What is the name of a Baron that fought at Waterloo and now has descendants that call pharvey a neighbor?
[EDIT] Without searching, think I have an idea - famous family obviously, Banker?
With searching, I think I have a better idea 8) - Baron Raglan, who lost his right arm at Waterloo. The family seat is in Monmouthshire.
No, different extremity.
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Re: History Challenge & Journal

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Come on pharvey, get off the cider! It is around here:

Llanfair­pwllgwyngyll­gogery­chwyrn­drobwll­llan­tysilio­gogo­goch
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Re: History Challenge & Journal

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pharvey wrote: Mon Feb 10, 2020 3:50 pm 1. Something to do with a Lord Lieutenant?
2. Not having the above?
1. The ceremonial counties are areas of England to which are appointed a Lord Lieutenant, and are defined by the government as counties and areas for the purposes of the Lieutenancies Act 1997 with reference to the metropolitan and non-metropolitan counties of England and Lieutenancies Act 1997.

2. Bit of a cheat, but I'll give you that!

3. (Hint) It's to do with what they were in Saxon times...
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Re: History Challenge & Journal

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dtaai-maai wrote: Mon Feb 10, 2020 4:28 pm 3. (Hint) It's to do with what they were in Saxon times...
Didn't search, but "Asked a Friend" - He seems to think it was something to do with division or separation. As a Yorkshireman, he mentioned Yorkshire, York the "Ridings"...? Then again, we had a beer or two........ :oops:

:cheers: :cheers:
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