Citizenship

Post by **Wanderlust** » Fri Feb 20, 2009 11:07 am

I've done a bit of Googling and the general impression I get is that the position on dual nationality for Thais is supremely unclear! However I did find this, from the Phuket Gazette http://www.phuketgazette.net/issuesansw ... asp?id=694;
“Section 13 of the Citizenship Act 1965 stipulates that a female Thai national who marries a foreigner and is later granted citizenship by her foreign husband’s home country shall maintain her Thai nationality.

There is no Thai law that stipulates that she must lose her Thai citizenship. However, she may choose to revoke her Thai citizenship, a decision the Thai government will announce the Government Gazette.

For Thai children with dual nationality, the Citizenship Act (3rd issue) 1992 states that a Thai national with a foreign father may declare his or her intention to revoke Thai nationality within the year following the child’s 20th birthday.

The law does not mention that the child will automatically have his or her Thai citizenship revoked. If the child does not declare his or her intention to revoke Thai citizenship, that child will still hold Thai nationality.”

Monday, April 12, 2004 Satchaphand Atthakor, Deputy Director-General, Consular Affairs Department, Ministry of Foreign Affairs.

Post by **Big Boy** » Fri Feb 20, 2009 7:56 pm

First things first, I have every confidence in receiving an answer from the Thai Embassy in London. I entered in to quite an extensive exchange of e-mails with them several years ago, and it was from that information that I based my initial responses. they have answered several enquiries in the past.

I haven't asked for the legislation yet, but that can be a follow up question dependent upon the answer I receive.

Before this thread, I thought I knew chapter and verse on this subject. However, when caller (somebody whose opinion I respect a lot) threw in the fast ball I started to have doubts. Things change. Albeit, several other posters have inadvertantly supported what I originally said.

Until we receive the response from the Embassy, anything posted here will be no more than informed speculation - posted with the best of intentions. I would hope to have that response waiting for me when I get home from work this evening, if not Monday. If I have no response Monday, then I will hasten the Embassy.

Post by **Big Boy** » Mon Mar 02, 2009 11:41 pm

It was a long time coming, but I've received the Embassy's response today (original questions included for ease of reading):

Questions:

I have been married to a Thai lady for 20 years. We have 1 son aged 18. He was born in the UK, which is where we all currently reside.

I have several questions that I would like answered please ie:

If my wife takes up British Nationality, can she retain her Thai Nationality as well?

If she can hold Dual Nationality, does that affect her ability to be able to purchase land in Thailand should we decide to retire there later?

If she would still be able to purchase land in Thailand, would there be any special conditions (eg taxes) imposed?

I have previously been told that my son can take up Thai Nationality as well, but at the age of 21 he would have to decide which Nationality he wanted to retain.

At age 18, is he still eligible to apply for Thai Nationality?

Have the rules changed to allow him to retain Dual Nationality indefinitely?

Today's reply:

Further to your queries, the answers are

There are no restrictions on the Thai law regarding dual nationality
No if she has not renounced her Thai nationality, she is still able to own the land
See the answer 2
Yes. However, you, as his parents need to register his Thai Birth Certificate. However, to be Thai citizen, he needs to comply with the duties of Thai citizen too
You can gather more information regarding the Birth Certificate and Thai passport at

http://www.thaiembassyuk.org.uk/e_passport.html

Initial thoughts .......... I was wrong, the rules have indeed changed. It looks good for my son, but the drawback seems to be he needs to comply with the duties of Thai citizen too, which I presume means National Service

Post by **kendo** » Mon Mar 02, 2009 11:55 pm

Hi Big Boy,
Thanks for your efforts on this thread, very intresting reading.
For your son to become a Thai citizen he would have to be fluent Thai speaking so on that basis i think he would be to old to do the red and black ball lottery unless he is allready fluent.
Kendo.

Post by **Big Boy** » Tue Mar 03, 2009 12:08 am

For your son to become a Thai citizen he would have to be fluent Thai speaking

Where did this little snippet come from? I know quite a few Thai Birth Certificate holders who are not fluent in Thai.

My son can get by (almost fluent) with his spoken Thai, but would be totally lost with the written stuff.

Super Joe · Post by **Super Joe** » Tue Mar 03, 2009 12:16 am

Khundon1975 wrote:Hi ozuncle
Thanks for that info on your wifes dual nationality.
Most Thai girls who are married to a foreigner and hold a foreign passport/citizenship etc buy land in Thailand and build a house on it.
What I was really after was a definitive answer as to the legality of this.
Caller mentioned in his post that under the Thai Nationality act they retain Thai Nationality.
Does this also mean that they retain all the same rights, regarding land ownership as they would have, if they had not obtained citizenship of a foreign country.

The Thai wife of a foreign spouse CAN own land (they could not before a law change in 1999), as long as she HAS NOT renounced her Thai nationality officially with the relevant Thai ministry If she has renounced it she can apply for it back again.

Extract from Land Code Ammendment of 1999 - Section 96:
Acquisition of Land by Spouses of Aliens:
Any Thai having an alien spouse may purchase or accept land as a gift with no consideration and register the ownership of such land during marriage, under a condition that the spouse must jointly provide a written legal confirmation stating that the entire source of funds for such purchase or gift is solely from the "Personal Property" (as defined by Thai laws)
The house that sits on the land can be registered soley in the foreigners sole name.

SJ

Super Joe · Post by **Super Joe** » Tue Mar 03, 2009 1:14 am

Big Boy wrote:Initial thoughts .......... I was wrong, the rules have indeed changed. It looks good for my son, but the drawback seems to be he needs to comply with the duties of Thai citizen too, which I presume means National Service

BB, see section 7 and 14 of the linked Thai Nationality Act: http://www.unhcr.org/refworld/pdfid/3df7765e4.pdf

I've been advised that the 'Thai' son (whether born inside or outside Thailand) can avoid national service draft by renouncing his Thai nationality (he can apply for it back later) or staying off of any Tabien Baan's (Dul passports or not) until he is 30 years old, at that age they are exempt from draft.

SJ

Post by **Big Boy** » Tue Mar 03, 2009 1:29 am

Are you trying to tell us something

Well, it was a blank post a minute ago.

Thanks for that SJ

Super Joe · Post by **Super Joe** » Tue Mar 03, 2009 1:31 am

It didn't like a certain so showed nothing at all, found a different link to same thing and it worked!?!?!?

SJ

Post by **Khundon1975** » Tue Mar 03, 2009 1:38 am

SJ Thanks for that.

Big Boy

Thanks for your efforts, much appreciated.

Post by **kendo** » Tue Mar 03, 2009 4:36 am

Big Boy wrote:
For your son to become a Thai citizen he would have to be fluent Thai speaking
Where did this little snippet come from? I know quite a few Thai Birth Certificate holders who are not fluent in Thai.

My son can get by (almost fluent) with his spoken Thai, but would be totally lost with the written stuff.

I know to become a Thai citizen you have to be fluent Thai speaking i am not sure about written Thai, for the national service red and black ball lottery this is done when you are 21, so if he went for citizenship after this time he would miss the draw anyway.
Kendo.

Post by **BaaBaa.** » Tue Mar 03, 2009 4:58 am

kendo wrote:
I know to become a Thai citizen you have to be fluent Thai speaking

I'll tell my GF to inform her Grandfather then as he only speaks Cambodian, he's lived in Buriram all his life.

Super Joe · Post by **Super Joe** » Tue Mar 03, 2009 9:25 am

I believe Kendo is talking about a non-natural Thai citizen who applies for Thai citizen, then they have to go through a Thai language test, same with permanent residency.

SJ

Post by **kendo** » Tue Mar 03, 2009 2:48 pm

Super Joe wrote:I believe Kendo is talking about a non-natural Thai citizen who applies for Thai citizen, then they have to go through a Thai language test, same with permanent residency.

SJ

Correct SJ,
Question do they have to do a written test or just spoken.
Kendo.