Standards of refereeing

Post by **Randy Cornhole** » Sat Jul 01, 2006 3:31 am

As a totally non biased football observer one thing strikes me about the world cup. The obvious bad decisions regarding refs decisions. Some of them are verging on the ridiculous. Why oh why do they not have a forth official (video ref)
Personally i don't really care as i hate the game. Having ate my salt in Crawford's last week. (very tasty) But it spoils the game. For gods sake so many bad decisions. Games have turned on them. Do the football watching public not care? Do fifa not care? do the players not care? Do i care?

Post by **Wanderlust** » Sat Jul 01, 2006 12:28 pm

I have voted Yes on this; there were old arguments against it, namely that it would slow the game down too much, and 'it's all part of the game' but the first one is now negated because the game is now not as non- stop as it used to be, with constant interruptions as players berate the officials or attempt to waste time or feign serious injury. The second one never really held much favour but supposedly the errors would even themselves out 'over the season' but this is blatantly not the case, with, in general, the larger teams such as Man Utd, Arsenal, Chelsea and their equivalents in other nations and internationally seeming to get more decisions going their way. This is partly down to the officials, but I have maintained for a long time that it is impossible for them to make decisions correctly all the time now, particularly in the case of offside. Add to this the 'match fixing' scandals and the introduction of a video ref should be an easy decision to make for FIFA; I believe that it would improve the game dramatically, getting rid, almost overnight, of shirt pulling, diving, 'off the ball' fouls and all the irritations that have blighted the game in recent times, as well as the arguing with the ref scenario, which could become an instant red card offence along with several others. At the same time I believe an independent time keeper should be used, with time remaining showing on a scoreboard, so the referee can concentrate on matters at hand. He could be in constant communication with his assistant refs getting decisions right, and the players could finally get on with the game without trying to ensure a decision goes their way by exaggerating contact or waving imaginary cards in the refs face (should also be an instant red card offence).

Post by **Roppongi** » Sat Jul 01, 2006 12:47 pm

Well said Wanderlust. My thoughts exactly.

About time FIFA pulled its head out of the sand.

And while they're at it how about finding some way to balance out the distribution of 'resources.'

More money sitting on the bench for some of the big teams than all of the players for the poorer teams.

What's the point in having 20 teams in a league when only 3-4 teams really have a chance of winning the comp? Time to introduce some sort of draft system and salary cap to even things out, IMHO.

Post by **Big Boy** » Sat Jul 01, 2006 1:09 pm

Randy said:

Why oh why do they not have a forth official (video ref)

They already have 5 refs at each World Cup match. You are advocating a 6th official. However, I do support this move. Maybe the 6th official could do away with the need for the 4th and 5th official.............thinks...if this trend continues, the referee squad will be larger than the playing squad.

The key to making the video ref thing work would be to precisely specify the scope of their influence on the game. If they were to pick up every mis-doing on the pitch, the game would never be allowed to flow. I guess Randy is proposing a Rugby style system for dealing with only key decisions.

Having ate my salt in Crawford's last week.

So, you took the easy way out............any photos? I've checked your Blog page, but nothing there.

Post by **lomuamart** » Sat Jul 01, 2006 1:14 pm

Post by **Guess** » Sat Jul 01, 2006 4:43 pm

lomuamart wrote:LBW.

I thought that that was Baseball.

Anyway there are many elements to the introduction of technology. Many of the objections are unfounded and illogical.

As Wanderlust says they have been negated.

I believe in the softly softly approach as used in F1 racing where although radical changes are needed due to the rapid advancement in technology, rule changes have to be introduced piecemeal so as not to complicate the situation further and introduce new problems.

Video recording and replay available to the referees is one aid and it it ridiculous that the whole world can see an incident with in seconds from a multitude of angles but the referees cannot.

Other technology can be used to notify the referees of certain occurences within milliseconds. These would be things like whether or not the ball actually crossed a particular line and even if a player was offside when a ball was passed to him.

In many other debateable incidents the ball is out of play anyway so there is ample time to provide the referees with video recording adjudged decisions. This could be something like a shot on target being deflected out of play by a defender and the atttacking players appealing for a handball. Many complex or, unseen by the main referee, situations require lengthy conultations with the secondary officials anyway so that play is held up.

In potential yellow card situations it is not necessary to make an immediate decision. The player could be adjudged later, even after the game and be given the yellow card anyway. The rational behind the two yellow racrds equal a red is highly debateable anyway and should nbe scrapped but leaving the option of a red card to be issued on a first offence for a serious offence. I.e. one that risks injury to the opponent.

As for injuries themselves, all this rolling about on the floor in agony surely can be hightlighted by medical practitioners after the game.

This is just the tip of the iceberg. There are thousands of ideas that could be put into practise if the FIFA could dig themselves out of the ice age.

Also I believe that FIFA itself should be managed by more technically and politically aware countries such as Italy, Germany and Spain and Holland and leave the 19th century French administration to mange the world Boules tournament.

Of course I have to be very diplomatic here as I am running out of countries to offend.

Post by **olmate** » Sat Jul 01, 2006 5:59 pm

There are so many sports nowdays that have introduced video refereeing.
At first many fans of these sports had mixed reactions to the decision of introducing a video ref. But over time it has become acceptable.
Im not a soccer mad fanatic but it is quite a fast game and i have read many articles that it is only getting faster and harder for match officials to keep up with the game. I have said yes because soccer is nowdays a modern professional game, played by the majority of the worlds nations as the no 1 sport.
I would welcome video refereeing after many a poorly judged decision by referees during this world cup.
Mind you though this modern video reffereeing has mainly come about due to evolving media technology with slo mo replays and large numbers of cameras at grounds, which definitely puts pressure on match officials of any sport to make sure there decisions are the right ones or they will be vindicated by the media and fans almost imediately.

Post by **Randy Cornhole** » Sat Jul 01, 2006 7:08 pm

I would also have 10 min sending off for a yellow card but still keep 2 x yellow = red and off. This would have the advantage of the opposition benefiting then and there instead of the next team played.
Also 10 yards forward for free kicks for bad mouthing the ref.
The clock should also be stopped during the game so that when 90 Min's are up its the end.
Hang on a minute we have all these wonderful rules already its called Rugby Union....

Post by **lomuamart** » Sat Jul 01, 2006 7:15 pm

A tricky one. Personally, I wouldn't want a video referee. The game's quick, as others have said, and the ref, together with the linesmen are part of it as well.
Sure, there are some bad decisions, but then that's all part of the "game" isn't it?
If everything became too clinical, we wouldn't have anything to moan about.

Post by **Big Boy** » Sat Jul 01, 2006 8:48 pm

No way

Sure, there are some bad decisions, but then that's all part of the "game" isn't it?

It allows referees to fall into the temptation of making a quick buck. You are certainly not trying to tell me that so many bad decisions have been accidental. FIFA pick the best of the best referees in the world for this competition - and there are 5 at every match. I am convinced that certain teams are manipulating the results through bribery of officials.

A video replay would stop cheating by both players and officials.

Post by **Big Boy** » Sun Jul 02, 2006 3:52 am

..........................................Well what can I say? An Argentinian ref who obviously remembered the war! What a farce!

First half - blatant handball in the penalty area - not one of the 5 refs present claimed to have seen it - millions of people watching the video footage saw it from about 10 different angles. However, the Portugese goalie was very good, and would have had a much better than 50/50 chance of saving the penalty.

The Rooney incident - yes, he deserved it. Again the video footage showed the pre-match jibes from Ronaldo winding him up, and the secret winks to Scolari, and the tell tale body language immediately afterwards. In the same way as a deliberate dive is an offence, that was deliberate cheating, and Ronaldo should have been punished accordingly. He was just as guilty, if not more guilty than Rooney - his actions were clearly pre-meditated. Rooney's were just stupidity.

His piece de resistance - Carragher's penalty. It was looking as if England were actually going to put Portugal under pressure in the penalty competition. Carragher made it 2 - 2 with a perfect spot kick. The referee decides he's not ready, and makes him take it again..........pressure told, and Portugal are in the semis.

The sooner they find a way to curb this blatant (and probably corrupt) cheating, the better it will be all round.

Anyway. I'm not a sore loser - well done to

Ricardo.

That was some fantastic goalkeeping.

Post by **THAI ROB** » Sun Jul 02, 2006 4:28 am

No wonder the referee wasnt ready for Carrick he wasnt even playing! You mean Carragher. He showed his nerves the referee clearly hadnt blown for the kick to be taken. Sven failed to get what should have been a good side playing. Euro 2008?

Post by **Big Boy** » Sun Jul 02, 2006 5:01 am

Thai Rob correctly pointed out:

Carrick he wasnt even playing! You mean Carragher.

Maybe it wasn't such a bad celebration party after all

Post by **Harry** » Sun Jul 02, 2006 4:59 pm

Should there be a video referee in football?

Yes, for major competitions... reference to a TV replay should be manageable without slowing down the game noticeably.

Post by **Jockey** » Sun Jul 02, 2006 8:28 pm

Big Boy wrote:..........................................Well what can I say? An Argentinian ref who obviously remembered the war! What a farce!

First half - blatant handball in the penalty area - not one of the 5 refs present claimed to have seen it - millions of people watching the video footage saw it from about 10 different angles. However, the Portugese goalie was very good, and would have had a much better than 50/50 chance of saving the penalty.

The Rooney incident - yes, he deserved it. Again the video footage showed the pre-match jibes from Ronaldo winding him up, and the secret winks to Scolari, and the tell tale body language immediately afterwards. In the same way as a deliberate dive is an offence, that was deliberate cheating, and Ronaldo should have been punished accordingly. He was just as guilty, if not more guilty than Rooney - his actions were clearly pre-meditated. Rooney's were just stupidity.

His piece de resistance - Carragher's penalty. It was looking as if England were actually going to put Portugal under pressure in the penalty competition. Carragher made it 2 - 2 with a perfect spot kick. The referee decides he's not ready, and makes him take it again..........pressure told, and Portugal are in the semis.

The sooner they find a way to curb this blatant (and probably corrupt) cheating, the better it will be all round.

Anyway. I'm not a sore loser - well done to Ricardo. That was some fantastic goalkeeping.

The referee had a very good match. It was NOT deliberate hand ball. Beckham was 5 yards away and kicked the ball on to his hand. The portugal defender tried to take his hand out the way.

The sending off was justified - if a little harsh. Players have been winding other players up in team sports for over a century. A professional on millions should be able to handle it.

A referee must blow his whistle before a penalty is taken. Ricardo was not ready because the whistle had not been blown, therefore the referee was correct (again).

I suspect Big Boy you think the referee was bad because your team lost. Blame your players, not the referee, not Ronaldo, not even Roony. English players were just not good enough.