Mac verses PC

[matthew80]

Howdy! Just wondering what the average ex-pat flavour is: Mac or PC. I am a die-hard MAC user, and have never experienced any of the issues common to PC users - hence the reason why I am a die-hard MAC user. Currently own a G4 laptop which is the cat's ass! Is there even a market and infrastructure for Apple in Thailand? Hope so!

[Randy Cornhole]

I used both in the UK, PC for work and Mac for home. Without a shadow of a doubt the Mac far surpassed the PC. When I came out here I decided to go for a Mac laptop but soon discovered the limitations on software etc. Sure you can get most software by going to bangkok but PC software/hardware is everywhere and very cheap! So I went with the masses and bought a PC.

[Bamboo Grove]

Started with Mc but been a PC user now for years, both have their good and bad points. Would be happy to use them simultaniously.

[JD]

Started with Mc but been a PC user now for years, both have their good and bad points. Would be happy to use them simultaniously.

With a mac you can, and all on the same computer, with a pc you can't.

[Guess]

I was a Mac user for a couple of years and then my company got taken over by a PC manufacturer. We, of course, had to transfer straight away to MS/Intel.

There was only minor disruption and the thought of having your flaky two year old machine being replaced by the best laptop money could buy stopped people from moaning to much. Everything we used was more or lees the same as it had been on the Mac. We had all sorts of Firewalls and Virus software to protect us from intrusion so di not gfet many of the problems that many users had.

We did have relaibilty issues introduced however which faded dramatically when migrating to NT.

The story was differrnt with the marketing people. They had a rebellion and threatend mass resignations if they had to use PCs as the PC would not allow the graphics capabilities of the Mac.

A compromise was reached whereas they were allowed to keep the Macs under the desk behind closed doors so long as it had a Compaq mouse and keyboard attached and a PC or laptop had to placed on top of the desk just in case a customer should walk past the office.

A few years later (mid to late nineties) when I was selling the things it became apparent that the Mac had established itself a market in areas where grpahic capabailities are required. That maekt was almost impossible tom penetrate and still today Mac are big in advertising and publishing and general media businesses.

Probably a lot more than you wanted but I would advise now that I can speak freeley, that if you can afford it, always buy a Mac. The additional cost will not necessarily be in the initial hardware purchases but in software and upgrades later. Pirated software is available even here in Hua Hin but the larger manufacturers like Adobe are getting more and more difficult to replicate and Thailand is gradually climbing onto the copyright laddder with many prosecutions happening here already. Of course there is the ethical matter of piracy to be considered.

I would reword JDs statement to "with a Mac you can, with a PC you can do less and the health risks are greater."

There was a serious motion made in the Senate to put a Surgeon General's health warning on every PC but it did not apply to a Mac or any other computer except games machines. That should tell you something.

[buksida]

I've been a PC man since they first became mainstream, but as mr Caine says "I do it for a living" so have to know a hell of a lot more about your average PC than how to use it.

I could never be bothered with the learning curve of a Mac, sure that little expanding menu is really groovy but everything else just slightly technical seems to be a nightmare. I agree stability wise Macs are superior but so is their price tag. You can build and run a solid high spec PC thats super stable if you know what you're doing and you don't download crap off the internet.

As mentioned above, I also can't get the software I use to run on a Mac and everything else you need to download for them wants your credit card so I think I'll stick with my PC for now!

[Locturian]

The question is much similar to the question "What do you use, Windows or Linux" - The Linux users, are much like the Mac users, happy with their "niche" thing, and defends it severely in any debate.

Mac/Linux users always use the same arguments, "My xxx is much more stabile than windows (or pc).

But, guys, here's the fact. Both for a PC and for Windows, the support for software, and upgrades, are larger and better. The pc/windows is for anyone, your grandma, your disabled uncle or your kid. Try setting a five year old up with a Mac or a Linux box? See where that get's ya?

About the stability of the PC/Windows - Well, it all depends how you treat it... Same with the car - Let the wife drive it for a while, and see how it handles - The clutch is burned out, the stearing is a little off, and there's small dents in the bumper - Same with the PC. Protect is with decent software, and don't download crap of the net - Then you should be set for a happy time...

Mac and Linux are for the people that just like's to be different, or for people that NEEDS is for sertain types of jobs. Sure, the Mac is SUPREME for audio or visual work, cause, it's what it's made for. For anything else, the pc beats it by a mile. You can install pretty much anything on a pc, you can't do that on a mac. The usability is much better at a PC/Windows... I have about 15 years experience with pc's and mac's, so, i've tried a little bit of everything, i still stick with my power-ass pc, so bring on your Mac, and it will leave you in the dust...

[PeteC]

This is good as experts are present. Please tell me why?:

1) Norton System Works 2005 plays havoc with my Fujitsu laptop?

2) Windows firewall and Norton firewall don't want to turn off and allow my BlackIce to function as it should?

3) Why Windows XP Home is crap as compared to Professional? (The above 2 problems do not happen on my other Fujitsu loaded with Pro??)

4) Why on XP Home commands are delayed and notices/sounds of function completion are seen/heard 60 seconds or more after the fact?

5) Why when automatic MS updates is turned off, everything simply slows down in performance when on-line?

This is a relatively powerful laptop, 1.60 ghz and 564 ram. Thanks. Pete

[Wanderlust]

The question is much similar to the question "What do you use, Windows or Linux" - The Linux users, are much like the Mac users, happy with their "niche" thing, and defends it severely in any debate.

Mac/Linux users always use the same arguments, "My xxx is much more stabile than windows (or pc).

But, guys, here's the fact. Both for a PC and for Windows, the support for software, and upgrades, are larger and better. The pc/windows is for anyone, your grandma, your disabled uncle or your kid. Try setting a five year old up with a Mac or a Linux box? See where that get's ya?

About the stability of the PC/Windows - Well, it all depends how you treat it... Same with the car - Let the wife drive it for a while, and see how it handles - The clutch is burned out, the stearing is a little off, and there's small dents in the bumper - Same with the PC. Protect is with decent software, and don't download crap of the net - Then you should be set for a happy time...

Mac and Linux are for the people that just like's to be different, or for people that NEEDS is for sertain types of jobs. Sure, the Mac is SUPREME for audio or visual work, cause, it's what it's made for. For anything else, the pc beats it by a mile. You can install pretty much anything on a pc, you can't do that on a mac. The usability is much better at a PC/Windows... I have about 15 years experience with pc's and mac's, so, i've tried a little bit of everything, i still stick with my power-ass pc, so bring on your Mac, and it will leave you in the dust...

I have to disagree with you on your reasoning here;you use the 'larger' support for upgrades and software as a testament to why Windows/PCs are better, but the simple fact is that Macs rarely require upgrades because the operating system and Apple software isn't full of holes that need patching in the first place! There is more software available for Windows machines, but more does not necessarily mean better; I have found that the only area the Mac suffers in comparison to PCs is games - everything else is there, and normally much better written for the Mac than the PC. The biggest problem I encounter is the fact that Microsoft do not write good software most of the time as they are writing it to cope with the limitations of their own operating system, so when it is adapted for the Mac it really is shown up! However because of the superb marketing job MS did, everyone uses the far inferior Windows, so to be able to communicate with the sheep, Mac users have to step down to their level and use inferior software (e.g. Office). I'm sure Linux and other users will say the same.
Your other argument is essentially saying that Windows/PCs are more user friendly than Macs, which is just plain daft! They are different, but my experience on computers over the last 20 years has the Mac winning hands down as far as usability goes. Start up is quicker, maintenance if needed is easier, moving files and folders has always been much easier, naming files doesn't have the stupid restrictions that Windows does....I could go on but your post smacks of a committed Windows user who has tried and failed to use a Mac because it is different. You use the example of a wife treating your car badly, or a five year old using a computer for the first time - press the wrong keys on a Windows machine and all hell breaks loose, but do the same on a Mac and no problem. Programme crash on a PC? Complete shut down or freeze. On a Mac? Well just that programme is affected and you can carry on without having to reboot - they even have a nice feature called 'Force quit' which allows you to select a programme that isn't responding and start it again.
Mac (and I am sure Linux) users do not do so because they want to be different, they do so because they believe them to be better; popularity does not necessarily mean better, it normally means cheaper, and you get what you pay for.

[matthew80]

Excellent! It seems like we have knowledgable computer users here! That's good, because I have a MAC G4 lap-top, and I would be greatful for some imput on a few problems I've been experiencing...First...oops...sorry...forget it.. I'm a bit mixed up. Actually I was thinking about my dad's Dell...

[buksida]

This is good as experts are present. Please tell me why?:

1) Norton System Works 2005 plays havoc with my Fujitsu laptop?

2) Windows firewall and Norton firewall don't want to turn off and allow my BlackIce to function as it should?

3) Why Windows XP Home is crap as compared to Professional? (The above 2 problems do not happen on my other Fujitsu loaded with Pro??)

4) Why on XP Home commands are delayed and notices/sounds of function completion are seen/heard 60 seconds or more after the fact?

5) Why when automatic MS updates is turned off, everything simply slows down in performance when on-line?

This is a relatively powerful laptop, 1.60 ghz and 564 ram. Thanks. Pete

I'll have a crack at this although it really should be in its own thread.

1) NSW is a very resource hungry piece of kit and laptops tend to have a whole bunch of their own stuff running in the background. Conflicts between these often occur, personally I wouldn't recommend NSW.

2) You can't run more than one firewall, you're effectively trying to run three. Choose the one you want and ditch the other two, Black Ice will conflict with NSW.

3) XP Pro has a lot more networking and admin stuff in it, as the name says its more for people who like to tinker. Home is a stripped down version more for limited users.

4) This one seems to be a memory or processing problem, you say it has 564 megs of RAM, thats a bizarre figure, its usually 512 with some shared for the graphics card.

5) This shouldnt happen at all, I never have MS updates on, sounds like something else is causing it, possible one of your 3 firewalls or the dialup connection. If anything having them on will slow it down as its constantly trying to download patches to Gate's flakey software.

[buksida]

but the simple fact is that Macs rarely require upgrades because the operating system and Apple software isn't full of holes that need patching in the first place!

There are holes, the simple reason is that nobody writes viruses, trojans, malware or hacks into Macs because they want to attack the mainstream which is Windows. Writing a virus for a Mac would have very little effect as the market share is so small, the people that do this do it for notoriety, this is why Billy keeps needing to patch his systems.

The biggest problem I encounter is the fact that Microsoft do not write good software most of the time as they are writing it to cope with the limitations of their own operating system, so when it is adapted for the Mac it really is shown up!

This I agree with, I'm not a big fan and I try and avoid it. This thread should be M$ v Apple as the hardware side of it really doesnt come into play, machines are limited by their software. (Wait till you get a load of Windows Vista due for release at the end of the year)

Start up is quicker, maintenance if needed is easier, moving files and folders has always been much easier, naming files doesn't have the stupid restrictions that Windows does....

All depends on the machine and setup, I've seen Macs take forever to boot up, freeze up, throw up error screens, crash and need rebooting. It once took me over an hour to setup a Mac on our LAN, a 30 second job in Windows.

Mac (and I am sure Linux) users do not do so because they want to be different, they do so because they believe them to be better; popularity does not necessarily mean better, it normally means cheaper, and you get what you pay for.

Not necessarily, you can build a PC that far exceeds a Mac in terms of performance, people use what they're used to and what they feel comfortable with. My point was that I wont go near a Mac because I don't need the new learning curve, it would defeat the purpose as on a Mac it would take me four times longer to get the job done regardless of the speed of the machine, its like learning a new language for me, I'm far too old for that!

[PeteC]

Tnanks BK. I will investigate and start a new thread if more needed. Ram is 504, typo. Pete.

[rosso]

Hello

I use LINUX and its by far the best OS. Everything is free and absolutley stable. No chance for MAC / Windows

regards
Rosso

and another 5 days to wait until back to HH

[pynnonen80]

There are holes, the simple reason is that nobody writes viruses, trojans, malware or hacks into Macs because they want to attack the mainstream which is Windows. Writing a virus for a Mac would have very little effect as the market share is so small, the people that do this do it for notoriety, this is why Billy keeps needing to patch his systems.

I agree 100% with you about that previous comment!!!

I have now worked around 2,5 years with Mac and I have to say that for my work (Graphic Designing), Mac is the best choice so far. But I know that there is quite many working fields where you can't use Mac at all (but I'd like to see how Mac could get through those works what most of PCs can (i.e. 3D modeling, CAD). Those are fields where Mac doesn't have almost any kind of programs. So games are not the only things what Mac is lack! (Mac has programs but not enough for comparing those to each other).

Apple has said that Mac has so good firewall that it's impossible to crack it.... I have seen that a guy has cracked it in 10 minutes and after that he got total control of the whole Mac.
So I'm 100% sure that Mac is quite safe now, but only because people are not attacking against it, but that's gonna change in a few years. So please all Mac users enjoy your time now but I know that it's not gonna last long any more.

And even Linux is not a best choice for home users.... Only "standard" what Linux got is the kernel what Linus proofs every time when they need to update it. Linux got also the same problem than Mac: lack of programs. I know that Linux got a lot of programs but mainly I meant that it doesn't have a big standard programs which most of the people are using.

Mac is for users who wants to live they life without knowing the evil side of the world. (Designers & everyday use), Linux is for people who really like to tweak and tweak things (Mainly servers)... PC is for everything and for everyone, but I would say that you need to learn certain things and rules before you can really enjoy.

Like everybody can read between the lines I'm a PC guy mainly.