Wine

[hhfarang]

Obviously, we need a wine thread as it is probably the most popular alcoholic beverage in the world next to beer.

I know California wines pretty well after living near the production regions for 15 years, and I know a bit about Australian wines and Chilean wines, but outside that, I'm lost. I have had wonderful French, Italian, Argentinean, and South African wines, but I can never remember what they were when I go to shop again. I've also had Greek wines, but they all tasted like kerosene to me and Spanish wines which I found passable as table wines but never found a really good one. Germany also produces some good wines, but in general, most of them (that I've had occasion to try at least) are too sweet for my taste. There are so many wines in the world that it is difficult to keep track of the good, bad, and ugly, and then it is further complicated by vintages.

My wine preferences run to the dry or at least medium dry, like Cabernet Sauvignon, Bordoux, Zinfandel (a California invention as far as I know and difficult to find here), or Merlot in reds (there are some good varieties of Italian reds that I don't remember the names of too), or Chardonnay, Sauvignon Blanc, and a few dryer Chenin Blancs and Semillion Chardonnays in whites. I love wine and drink it daily, but it is soooo expensive here that I have been reduced to mostly drinking boxed wine that is barely passable as a table wine.

In our discussions of wines on this thread, I hope someone who knows the local market better than me can recommend some value priced wines that are available in Hua Hin and that are much better than the cheap boxed wines. Nothing is better than a glass (or three) of a good wine with good food!

Here's one of my favorites in the world, but unfortunately, not available here:

[crazy88]

A staple for the girls in my house HHF also.

At the lower end Mont Clair is passable as a staple along with Franzia. Most of the other boxes are not fit for cooking at best.

Still at the lower end per bottle (under 500 Bt) you have Little penguin, Kookaburra, Cudgee creek and the Jacobs creek. All well more costly than at home but perfectly acceptable with a meal. Mid range has a good choice in Villa and the wine cellar. Pouilly fuisse being my choice on a white followed by a Macon village. CNDP on a red. High end you can pay 3x the price you would at home.

Crazy 88

[Spitfire]

Peter Vella red wine in the 3 liter box is also a passable choice for table/general drinking.

Must say I like a few of the Australian wines like Penfolds etc, verg good for the price and go down a treat

Spanish reds also give you a decent red for the price, more so than the French or Italian wines, Faustino Rioja springs to mind.

A decent French red of the top of my head would be Chateau Neuf de Pap (The Pope's ninth castle), very nice but price is off-putting.

I'm certainly a fan of red wine.

[TypicallyTropical]

OK guys, wine in a box is not a wine. In fact, you shouldn't even buy wine in a bottle larger than 0.75 liter, except dessert wines. (They age the best in that bottle.) Most every country make good wines as well as bad wines. (Even Greece!)
I have two portable wine cellars in my condo, 30 bottles each, and my collection include some really good Bordeaux going back as far as 1982. (My most priced one is a 1989 Ch. Margaux!) It's funny, my wife doesn't drink but she always takes a sip of my wine when I open a bottle. Interestingly, she can always tell if it's an expensive French or just an every day wine from whatever country!

[pitsch]

[quote="Spitfire"]A decent French red of the top of my head would be Chateau Neuf de Pap (The Pope's ninth castle), very nice but price is off-putting. [quote]

Chateauneuf-du-Pape means the Pope's new castle. Pope Jean XXII of Avignon built the chateau here in 1320 as a summer palace.

I agree that they have a very good wine, but in general the famous french wines, especially the Burgundy's and Bordeaux's are overpriced very much, compared to good Californian and Australian wine.

[hhfarang]

OK guys, wine in a box is not a wine.

I thought that to TT until I lived here a while and was paying $25 per bottle for a wine that I could get for $6 in California. You have no choice here but to adjust your thinking if you drink wine daily unless, that is, you are a very rich person from Hawaii...

[PeteC]

Here's a little site that explains the red wine grapes/varieties. Personally I enjoy a good Pinot Noir followed by Merlot, then Shriaz and Cabernet. Pete

http://www.frenchscout.com/types-of-red-wines

PS: Having said the above, the best bottle of red wine I've ever had in my life is a bottle of 1983 Mondavi cabernet. Reward if anyone can find a bottle still in existence.

[hhfarang]

Here's a little site that explains the red wine grapes/varieties. Personally I enjoy a good Pinot Noir followed by Merlot, then Shriaz and Cabernet. Pete

Yes Pete, I forgot, I like some Pinot Noirs as well as Shiraz types also!

[Homer]

OK guys, wine in a box is not a wine.

And wine in a screw top bottle is not wine. Unless you compare American screw top bottled wine to France's vin de table / vin ordinaire, in which case the French stuff finishes in a distant second place.

[Spitfire]

Thanks for the clarification there Pitsch, been a while since I was reading about that wine, but agree, is good but the price tag just says "bend over" though.

The point I'd like to mention about wine here in LOS is the fact that it seems not to have sunk in yet about taking care of it properly, 'corked' is a disproportionately real threat every time you buy a bottle here, even if it's in air-con in a shop, the conditions upon which it's got to said location is always up for question.

Wine is sensitive to a load of stuff, not to mention heat and sunlight.

I still think it's a case of 'buyer beware' here, gamble every time.

I must say I've bought wine in bottles here only to think how long it must have sat there in the shop under zero interaction from the staff.

These days, I still do buy that Peter Vella in a box, even though the previous posters are technically correct with their dismissive stance about it not really being wine. However, can be one of the few guaranteed products that isn't compromised to a greater or lesser degree as it has a high turnover rate. It is however table red at best, but generally hassle/disappointment free on the expectations front.

Yes, it's not great and comments absorbed and agreed with in a purist's world.

However, here, I'm tired of buying bottles that are corked or have been ill-treated as, afraid to say, the Thais can't take care of wine for shit.

Edit - Regarding the above, then it may be less of a problem in tourist areas or BBK, but once you get anywhere else then the problems mentioned can rise come to think of it.

[hhfarang]

Yes Spitfire, you're right, but I think the one thing that will ruin wine the fastest is to let the cork dry so that air gets in. It's a lot more tolerant to heat than most think. When I see a shop with dusty old bottles standing vertically on a shelf I am always wary, however, that said, at least 50% of the vintners now are using artificial corks that do not dry out and shrink like real cork does if the bottle is not stored horizontally.

As for temperature, I like red wines at room temp, that's around 70 to 72 degrees Fahrenheit or 21 to 22 Celsius, and I hate to be served a dry red wine in a restaurant here chilled, which is what most of them do. Years ago I read an article about wine and temperature and in the 18th and 19th centuries they discovered that wines were better when brought to the "new world" than the same vintage was in it's home country. Through some experimentation they discovered that the temperature changes on the long sailing voyages from cold to hot to cold to hot, etc., actually made the wine better.

I've kept bottles stored properly (horizontally) here in my wine rack for a year or more in the kitchen which varies between 35c and 22c over time and with cooking and with and without aircon and none have gone bad.

As for screw tops being only for cheap or bad wine, that too is beginning to be a thing of the past as there are a couple of Australian vintners that use screw tops, at least on their mid range wines and those are quite good imo.

[caller]

I wonder why Tescos in Hua Hin don't sell their excellent aussie red that costs 3.47 in the UK. A great 12% everyday glugging wine!

I love wine, but aussie wines I find overpriced in the UK, same with many Yank wines, which for me makes the South American wines, usually from Argentina and Chile, excellent value. Chile in particular, does some great Pinot Noir, cabernat and Savignon Blanc.

I found the Chilean wines better value in Hua Hin when I was last there - but the prices now - ouch!

[Amarita]

Where do you get the Peter Valla wine ?
I havent seen the one around ?

[TypicallyTropical]

PS: Having said the above, the best bottle of red wine I've ever had in my life is a bottle of 1983 Mondavi cabernet. Reward if anyone can find a bottle still in existence.

So what is the reward?

BPWINE CA: Robert Mondavi Cabernet Sauvignon Reserve 1983, $65.00

Aabalat Fine & Rare Wines CA: Robert Mondavi Reserve Cabernet Sauvignon, 1983 $79.75 (Online-Ordering World-Wide-Delivery)

Sterling Cellars NY: Robert Mondavi 1983 Reserve $79.99

[PeteC]

Thanks, I'm glad to see it still exists. After having many bottles at various Bay Area restaurants and wine shops around 1988, it disappeared. Perhaps bought up by the speciality shops that are selling it now. Your info though makes it possible to pre-order a few bottles before I arrive conus for a visit. Pete