
Why Do Sellers Usually Include A Photo Of The Fusebox
Re: Why Do Sellers Usually Include A Photo Of The Fusebox
Thanks for your help Nereus 

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Re: Why Do Sellers Usually Include A Photo Of The Fusebox
Of more use (and revealing) would be a photo taken in the roof space to show if the wiring is, as quite likely, a complete mess resembling a birds nest of tangled wires joined together by twisting and covered by tape with odd bits of wire used to suspend it from the roof trusses.
Ideally it should be protected in conduit and joints properly made with approved connectors.
A nice picture of a modern fusebox / consumer unit with labelled circuit breakers etc. is a start but it's what you can't see that matters.
Ideally it should be protected in conduit and joints properly made with approved connectors.
A nice picture of a modern fusebox / consumer unit with labelled circuit breakers etc. is a start but it's what you can't see that matters.
Re: Why Do Sellers Usually Include A Photo Of The Fusebox
ok BB thanks for the pics,i have never seen pics like these in ads before.
looks like typical thai style townhouse/small bungalow installations, im guessing in the 1-2m baht price range.
which means-
1. 5/15A meter installed. small power consumption only, one a/c maybe 2.definately no oven and a/c at the same time.etc.
2. wiring will be a mess as already stated.
3. adding extra wiring will be a pain in d ar@e and will always show.
4. your neighbours on one side will be making and selling dried squid 24/7.
the other side will be a recycling plant.
looks like typical thai style townhouse/small bungalow installations, im guessing in the 1-2m baht price range.
which means-
1. 5/15A meter installed. small power consumption only, one a/c maybe 2.definately no oven and a/c at the same time.etc.
2. wiring will be a mess as already stated.
3. adding extra wiring will be a pain in d ar@e and will always show.
4. your neighbours on one side will be making and selling dried squid 24/7.
the other side will be a recycling plant.

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Re: Why Do Sellers Usually Include A Photo Of The Fusebox
The neighbors' houses that I've been in have the same so it may not be that unusual in more modern (foreigner targeted) Hua Hin housing. I've yet to encounter another house with two though, but the electrician who interviewed me during construction about what we would have in the house said we needed the second one (at a cost of about 20k if I remember correctly). It may be due to the fact that we have eight industrial type air conditioners (4 of them way bigger than the normal unit and 2 are as big as the two central air units I had in Florida, the outside part being about a meter size cubes). Plus, besides five water pumps, and an electric gate, we may have more large appliances than most houses, like a European clothes washer and dryer, built in electric dishwasher, oven, microwave, hob, and professional style vent hood, three refrigerators, three TVs and a host of other electrical stuff. We also have hundreds of indoor and outdoor lights and (again if I remember correctly) the electrician said you could only put about a dozen of those on one breaker.HHF photos are commercial type 3 phase "load centres", most unlikely to be found in a house
Big Boy, I've also seen the small one in your second photo in some nice homes and I think it comes in different sizes depending on how many breakers you need so if you don't need more that six or eight breakers, I think that kind is probably ok. That was what was in the rental we lived in while our home was being built. It had three normal aircon units a water pump and water heaters in two of the showers. The only other electrical items we used were the TV, computer, some counter top kitchen appliances and lighting and that box seemed to be sufficient, but it was mounted in plain view on the living room wall!
Also as stated by another poster, the wiring in that house looked like it consisted of bits and pieces collected from someone else's construction leftovers. I went into the ceiling myself to run the internet (phone) line to a different room than it was originally installed and the wiring up there was just lying on the ceiling tiles, not in conduits and looked like it was all bits that were no more than a meter long twisted and taped together with electrical tape. You definitely want the wiring in conduits and using proper junction boxes where there is a break in the wire (and grounded), or else at least make sure your fire and health (and life) insurances are up to date.

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Re: Why Do Sellers Usually Include A Photo Of The Fusebox
I second the suggestion to pay attention to what's above the ceiling. I don't think conduit is used much in older housing. We had a weird experience due to lack of proper wiring enclosure.
We have a house in Bangkok, probably 25 years old, I've owned it for about ten years. A few years after we bought it, my wife and son arrived there ahead of me by a few days. The night before I flew in she called me and said all the power was off. I told her to check the main circuit breaker, but that was like asking her to do open heart surgery. They did without power until I got there. I opened the box which was similar to the one in the pictures above, but with about 15 circuits. Everything seemed fine so I unscrewed the cover and behind where all the wires come in was a mouse/rat fried between two contacts. It shorted out the main circuit. I'm comfortable working with 120v systems, but I didn't want to mess with this so I left it until morning and called a local guy to come remove it. (Didn't want to take any money for the job either).
We have a house in Bangkok, probably 25 years old, I've owned it for about ten years. A few years after we bought it, my wife and son arrived there ahead of me by a few days. The night before I flew in she called me and said all the power was off. I told her to check the main circuit breaker, but that was like asking her to do open heart surgery. They did without power until I got there. I opened the box which was similar to the one in the pictures above, but with about 15 circuits. Everything seemed fine so I unscrewed the cover and behind where all the wires come in was a mouse/rat fried between two contacts. It shorted out the main circuit. I'm comfortable working with 120v systems, but I didn't want to mess with this so I left it until morning and called a local guy to come remove it. (Didn't want to take any money for the job either).
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Re: Why Do Sellers Usually Include A Photo Of The Fusebox
He probably considered lunch (fried rat) payment enough.(Didn't want to take any money for the job either).



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Re: Why Do Sellers Usually Include A Photo Of The Fusebox
Well HHF, I don`t think that you can quote your house as anywhere "normal". What the contractor told you, and what the accepted practice is in countries that use and enforce a code, is that far apart as to be laughable. For a start, did they do a "maximum demand calculation"? Unless you employed a contractor that was experienced in large commercial installations, then what he told you was not much more than a guess!
I have 8 aircons, electric cooking range with oven, 4 hot water heaters, 2 water pumps for the house and garden, 2 water pumps for the swimming pool, dishwasher, washing machine, tumble dryer, 8 large ceiling fans and also enough lights to watch a football match.
All of that is on a single "consumer unit" with maybe 10 breakers, and is single phase, with a 30/100 amp supply. That's how it was built before I bought the house. It should never have been done like that, but is a perfect example of what goes on here. In Australia the supply authority would not connect such an installation.
As for running the wiring in conduit: it is neither necessary, or required, with the use of TPS type double insulated wiring in a domestic installation. The last time conduit was used in Australia for the complete installation, was back in the days 50 years ago when vulcanised rubber (VIR) cables were the norm. Conduit (plastic) is used to "chase" wiring down a solid wall, and to run in the main supply cables, but not for general house wiring. TPS cable is readily available and used here in Thailand.
Another "practice" that is perpetrated here is the mixing of lighting and power circuits on the one breaker. The conductor size required for lighting circuits in a house is usually 1.5 sq mm, and that for socket outlet power points, or "receptacles", is 2.5 sq mm. No prizes for guessing what most Thai installers will use when you consider the price difference.
Anyway, this thread is wandering of topic and is worthy of its own thread.
I have 8 aircons, electric cooking range with oven, 4 hot water heaters, 2 water pumps for the house and garden, 2 water pumps for the swimming pool, dishwasher, washing machine, tumble dryer, 8 large ceiling fans and also enough lights to watch a football match.
All of that is on a single "consumer unit" with maybe 10 breakers, and is single phase, with a 30/100 amp supply. That's how it was built before I bought the house. It should never have been done like that, but is a perfect example of what goes on here. In Australia the supply authority would not connect such an installation.
As for running the wiring in conduit: it is neither necessary, or required, with the use of TPS type double insulated wiring in a domestic installation. The last time conduit was used in Australia for the complete installation, was back in the days 50 years ago when vulcanised rubber (VIR) cables were the norm. Conduit (plastic) is used to "chase" wiring down a solid wall, and to run in the main supply cables, but not for general house wiring. TPS cable is readily available and used here in Thailand.
Another "practice" that is perpetrated here is the mixing of lighting and power circuits on the one breaker. The conductor size required for lighting circuits in a house is usually 1.5 sq mm, and that for socket outlet power points, or "receptacles", is 2.5 sq mm. No prizes for guessing what most Thai installers will use when you consider the price difference.
Anyway, this thread is wandering of topic and is worthy of its own thread.

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Re: Why Do Sellers Usually Include A Photo Of The Fusebox
Bring some Earth Leakage Switches......Big Boy wrote:Planning my big move for next year, I regularly scan the web to see what property is for sale. On many sites, where photographs of pre-owned properties are displayed, there is invariably a photo of the fusebox. Can somebody please tell me why it is so important to see a photo of the fusebox amongst the photos of various rooms?
Should I be looking for properties with a particular type/standard of fuse box?
Sorry if this is a stupid question, but for a complete diy type ignoramous like me, it seems a very strange thing to show prospective buyers. However, as so many do it, I'm sure there must be some relevance.

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Re: Why Do Sellers Usually Include A Photo Of The Fusebox
Even it it is not required, putting any kind of wiring inside a (PVC) conduit should be recommended as rats and mice love to eat wiring, and anything else they can sink their teeth into... which isn't PVC... yet, although they seem to be evolving as they ate (plastic) parts of my SUV engine. At any rate, any wires in my home (telephone, cable tv) that were not in PVC were replaced twice before I figured out the cause. As in the above post about the fried rat, they love wire insulation.... so protect any wiring you have!...As for running the wiring in conduit: it is neither necessary, or required...

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Re: Why Do Sellers Usually Include A Photo Of The Fusebox
TPS cable, with it's extra layer of outer insulation and similar to the flat T&E cable used in UK, is subject to rodent damage in some situations (according to wiki).
Therefore, it makes a lot of sense to insist on the use of inexpensive plastic conduit for extra protection as hhfarang has advised from personal experience.
Nereus is referring to Australian and UK practice of permitting TPS and not requiring conduit.
However, in Thailand if conduit is not specified there will always be the temptation to save the extra cost of TPS cable and use cheaper single insulated wires hidden in walls and roof spaces without the necessary protection given by conduit or TPS.
Therefore, it makes a lot of sense to insist on the use of inexpensive plastic conduit for extra protection as hhfarang has advised from personal experience.
Nereus is referring to Australian and UK practice of permitting TPS and not requiring conduit.
However, in Thailand if conduit is not specified there will always be the temptation to save the extra cost of TPS cable and use cheaper single insulated wires hidden in walls and roof spaces without the necessary protection given by conduit or TPS.
Re: Why Do Sellers Usually Include A Photo Of The Fusebox
I've been thinking about this thread a lot and I know Nereus is an expert in electricity so I don't mean to put his opinions down or argue with him, but this is Thailand and if the Australian standard of building (wiring not in conduits and small breaker panels) is true and similar to Thai typical Thai construction, then as far as I'm concerned the building trade Australia is a second world.
In all the U.S. homes I owned (a few) built since 1980, a breaker box similar to the photos I posted was present, and all (modern) homes are required as far as I know to have all wiring (mine all did, even the ones built in the '60s) run inside conduit of some sort.
If Australia is different, ok, that just means they have a lower standard of construction there.
Trust me, from personal experience here, you want all your wiring inside protective PVC pipe with PVC or metal junction boxes wherever the wire has a break. If not, you are asking for trouble.
And if you want to go with the small breaker box with the limitation of a few breakers for your entire property, go right ahead but some day you may regret that decision.
Like the cost of living thread, it all depends on your expectations, and I gather that people from my country expect a little better quality construction (and life in general) than people from others according to what the experts here have to say.
Be warned (Migrant) and others from the U.S. who are planning to retire here. Decide what you want and what you are willing to settle for before you buy and judge accordingly. I'm not saying that most people came/come here with the expectations I did but just make sure you get your money's worth and the quality you are expecting (and are accustomed to) so that you won't be disappointed.

In all the U.S. homes I owned (a few) built since 1980, a breaker box similar to the photos I posted was present, and all (modern) homes are required as far as I know to have all wiring (mine all did, even the ones built in the '60s) run inside conduit of some sort.
If Australia is different, ok, that just means they have a lower standard of construction there.
Trust me, from personal experience here, you want all your wiring inside protective PVC pipe with PVC or metal junction boxes wherever the wire has a break. If not, you are asking for trouble.
And if you want to go with the small breaker box with the limitation of a few breakers for your entire property, go right ahead but some day you may regret that decision.
Like the cost of living thread, it all depends on your expectations, and I gather that people from my country expect a little better quality construction (and life in general) than people from others according to what the experts here have to say.
Be warned (Migrant) and others from the U.S. who are planning to retire here. Decide what you want and what you are willing to settle for before you buy and judge accordingly. I'm not saying that most people came/come here with the expectations I did but just make sure you get your money's worth and the quality you are expecting (and are accustomed to) so that you won't be disappointed.

My brain is like an Internet browser; 12 tabs are open and 5 of them are not responding, there's a GIF playing in an endless loop,... and where is that annoying music coming from?
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Re: Why Do Sellers Usually Include A Photo Of The Fusebox
The difference is that in Australia electricians (and plumbers ?) have to pass exams and be licenced and registered before they can seek employment. If they don't follow the laid down regulations and cut corners they risk losing their job.
As stated earlier, finding a qualified electrician in Thailand who can calculate such things as power factors, maximum demand and breaker capacities is no easy task.Specifying the use of conduit is one way of ensuring good practice is followed and is also a great help if you ever need to make any additions or repairs.
As stated earlier, finding a qualified electrician in Thailand who can calculate such things as power factors, maximum demand and breaker capacities is no easy task.Specifying the use of conduit is one way of ensuring good practice is followed and is also a great help if you ever need to make any additions or repairs.
Re: Why Do Sellers Usually Include A Photo Of The Fusebox
It got me thinking as well HHF. My place has one breaker box similar to what you have. There was a separate circuit for each of the four aircons when we moved in. Since then I've added three more aircons and subsequently three new circuits and breakers, and a new one for a bore pump. My panel only has three spaces left for any new circuits. No room in there for a second panel and no idea what I'll do if one is needed. Pete 

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Re: Why Do Sellers Usually Include A Photo Of The Fusebox
This seems to be a regular problem. For future reference, when I've decided upon where I want to lay my hat, does anybody know somebody in the area who has the necessary skills please?chopsticks wrote:As stated earlier, finding a qualified electrician in Thailand who can calculate such things as power factors, maximum demand and breaker capacities is no easy task.Specifying the use of conduit is one way of ensuring good practice is followed and is also a great help if you ever need to make any additions or repairs.
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Re: Why Do Sellers Usually Include A Photo Of The Fusebox
If it becomes necessary then an additional sub-distribution board (consumer unit/breaker panel/fusebox) could always be fitted in a different location.prcscct wrote:It got me thinking as well HHF. My place has one breaker box similar to what you have. There was a separate circuit for each of the four aircons when we moved in. Since then I've added three more aircons and subsequently three new circuits and breakers, and a new one for a bore pump. My panel only has three spaces left for any new circuits. No room in there for a second panel and no idea what I'll do if one is needed. Pete
It may also be possible for some of the older style circuit breakers that were fitted to the original board to be replaced with newer ones, which, being physically smaller in width, allow for extra circuit breakers to be added onto the original panel rails if there's no risk of overloading.