Terror plot to bomb planes foiled in the UK

[lomuamart]

I've asked this question before but I still find it valid:
Why is Europe a restricted area for the buddhist Thai-ladies, but wide open for extremist militants?
Both the US and Europe needs more nice people! (and better looking).

Well my Thai wife got her visa earlier this week. I agree with you, Norseman

[Big Boy]

lomuamart wrote:

my Thai wife got her visa earlier this week

A bit off thread, but congratulations - I told you that you had nothing to worry about.

It always pleases me when somebody that is genuine gets issued with the visa that they want - well done!

[pookie]

The plot seems to have involved several passengers taking on different liquids, which could then be combined into an explosive, and detonated by a mobile phone battery using a smuggled detonator.
In light of this I think that within the next few days the international aviation authorities will bring out new guidelines which are likely to ban all liquids and all electrical devices from being carried on to aircraft, (with the obvious exceptions of medicines etc.).
The problem is that it is difficult to identify any particular constituent liquid, which would by itself, be innocent. Modern detonators are very small, about twice the size of a match head, and so very easy to conceal. After that, providing that you are a suicide bomber, you just need a battery.

The thing is with all this is that it gives the airlines a big stick in order to enforce their hand luggage guidelines with even more fervour than they have been doing over the years.
It will also give baggage handlers around the world orgasms at the thought of all that extra "booty" to be had, shouls said baggage handlers be of a mind to "help themselves"
All of which leads to a rather pointless measure when you can just go through passport control and buy a miriad of stuff to take on the plane, from soft drinks, toilitries, even handbags and luggage !!!!!!

Pookie

[STEVE G]

To give you an idea what people will steal from checked baggage, this story came from an airline internal magazine;

Ray Bolanos had been on a fishing trip to Alaska, where he caught a 75-pound halibut. He cut the fish in half and put it into two cooler boxes for the internal flight back to the continental U.S.
On arrival, he noticed the rope protecting one of the checked coolers had been cut, someone had stolen half of his halibut. "Someone has a lot of time on their hands to do inspections and take what they want and somehow take it out of the airport," Bolanos said.

[Jaime]

All of which leads to a rather pointless measure when you can just go through passport control and buy a miriad of stuff to take on the plane, from soft drinks, toilitries, even handbags and luggage !!!!!!

I am pretty sure that they won't be selling liquid explosives in airside duty free.

[lomuamart]

If it takes 4 hours to check-in, so what? Even longer, so what?
Personal inconvenience is nothing compared to the potential impact. Etc etc..

[DawnHRD]

All of which leads to a rather pointless measure when you can just go through passport control and buy a miriad of stuff to take on the plane, from soft drinks, toilitries, even handbags and luggage !!!!!!

I am pretty sure that they won't be selling liquid explosives in airside duty free.

Very true, but if this attempt was helped in any way by people employed by the airport (or any future attempt), all they need to do is get the stuff past the check-in point & put it into a duty free bag to hand to the terrorist who will board the plane. We're back to square one, then. And it has been known for airline employees to aid hijackings and terrorist actions on aircraft. I think more thought needs to be given - maybe duty free areas should be shut down, or a second check-in for duty free items?
Also, the more recent comments about baggage handlers stealing - wasn't that the point that pinksquid was initially making/questioning? I for one would also be slightly wary of checking in expensive items. Yes, there is always the option of not taking these items, but it's nice to know in advance what you can take, so you're not faced with a fait accompli. I think, initially, that's all she was trying to say.
I agree that personal inconvenience is not important compared to safety of all, but I must admit I dread the thought of a long haul flight without even a book to read (have you seen the prices of books in airports??! )
It's truly horrifying that now things as innocuous as baby milk can hide the ingredients necessary to blow people out of the sky. The security services that uncovered this plot deserve congratulations & thanks.

[hollygolightly1]

Well, I have to admit (at risk of being bombarded with evil replies) that I'm sceptical... it seems a convenient time to foil a major plot - divert attention from Lebanon, pat on the back for unpopular Blair etc. I was in New York during the great anthrax scare (and you wouldn't believe the items on breakfast tv - how to wear a gas mask fashionably....) which turned out to be the work of a homegrown nutter rather than an international terrorist organisation. I was also in London when the poor Brazilian believed to be a terrorist was shot. How come they got it so wrong then, failed to prevent 9/11 despite repeated warnings etc. yet have suddenly saved thousands of lives by uncovering a sketchy conspiracy? Everyone knows that creating a climate of fear is useful for government....

[PeteC]

You've got a right to your opinion, Holly, no one should slam you for that.

With this deal though, too many suspects in too many places. I think they are up to around 50 now who have been apprehended in both the UK and Pakistan, and I don't think they are finished yet. If it's a scam, it would be the best in history.

You're correct about 9-11. The Clinton administration had many warnings and "clues" but failed to put them all together and take things seriously, so to speak. It was an intelligence failure supreme. Pete

[STEVE G]

Dawn wrote;
I think more thought needs to be given - maybe duty free areas should be shut down, or a second check-in for duty free items?


Hi Dawn, for many years now the airline industry has wanted to move duty free sales to arrivals. This was for two reasons;

It would save on weight; it makes no sense flying all this stuff about the sky, when in most cases exactly the same brands are available at both ends.

It is an obvious safety hazard filling an aircraft full of glass bottles of inflammable liquids, even if you forget about terrorism. All materials used in the construction of the cabin have to meet very stringent fire resistance standards, bottles of Vodka don’t fulfill theses requirements, as you can imagine.

This sensible proposal has always been rejected by the customs authorities around the world, insisting that duty free items have to be physically exported overseas. Maybe now there can be a rethink on this.

[PeteC]

Write a letter to Postbag at the Bangkok Post, Steve. That's valuable info that I, and I think many others, have never heard before. Pete

[pasathai]

Why is Europe a restricted area for the buddhist Thai-ladies, but wide open for extremist militants?


could be the militarnt ( muslum) have more people representing them in government positions

[pasathai]

This sensible proposal has always been rejected by the customs authorities around the world, insisting that duty free items have to be physically exported overseas. Maybe now there can be a rethink on this.


simple solution ( so money can still be made) is pay for it at takeoff, pick it up on arrival.

also, are they still going to be pushing the duty free crap onboard?

as for goofey planning ( by airline in this exaample)

I took NWA flight ( first class with mileage) bkk, nrt, sea,sa on the flight from bkk they gave out the little kits, had sewing items in it, including a small I (blunt) scissors. did not get it taken away unitl sea to san flight screening,

seems nwa did not have much of a plan

[PeteC]

There was/is a thing about checked baggage also when coming from overseas and transiting to another flight in the USA for a continued journey.

IE., coming from Bangkok to Narita to SF, your luggage can be locked, they don't even ask you (or they didn't). However, if it is locked and you transit in the USA, when you pick it up at your final destination, it will be opened.

If they have skeleton keys that fit, great. If they don't, the locks will be broken or, the actual case slit and taped. There will be a note inside saying....."Your baggage has been opened and inspected and since it was locked, sorry..." In so many words.

Granted, this was more than 3 years ago that this was happening. I don't know about the present.

If it is still happening, much improvement needed between the bureaucrats controlling these things in different countries. Pete

[pookie]

I am pretty sure that they won't be selling liquid explosives in airside duty free.

What i meant by "pointless" is.....what would the cabin crew say/do when faced with people trying to board while in possesion of stuff that they aint supposed to be taking on the plane?
Only solution is no more airside shops/bars or other form of boredom relief.
I alway said flying is the most barbaric form of transport. Looks like its going to get a damn sight MORESO

Pookie