New Spanish Inquisition for Expats.

[Green Nomad]

Hi,

This maybe of interest to some of the forum members. It certainly would be if you, like me, are resident in Spain and having property or assets in Thailand.

There has been a new tax introduced recently for anyone having 'residencia', for tax purposes, who has assets outside of Spain amounting to more than 50,000 Euros for each case.

The reason I am putting this on the forum?,, My question is, Would I be taxed for our property in Hua Hin that is in my Thai wifes name?., because as you may work out it was financed by my money.

Is there anyone in the same situation as myself or anyone who knows about this and can give me some advice?

Regards GN

[easyas]

Just a thought. Wouldn't it be somewhat idiotic of you to admit (claim?) to the Spanish authorities that a property registered in the name of your Thai wife is anything to do with you? Best let sleeping dogs (bitches) lie!

[Green Nomad]

I agree easyas, I was not going to do that anyway, however I thought it would be good to spread the word around the expats who may have interests in Spain. It seems there is now a movement to counter this from expats there, its the sort of thing that could happen in Thailand also. It is as if its a money creating exercise from a government in financial crisis. GN

[caller]

To be honest GN, I'd be as worried about this happening in Spain:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-21814325

Its a news story, that whilst true, is beyond belief to me!

[Green Nomad]

Yes caller, I saw this the next day, another desperate country praying on the innocent citizens, what a cheek. Your damned if you do and if you don't these days!!

[STEVE G]

To be honest GN, I'd be as worried about this happening in Spain:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-21814325

Its a news story, that whilst true, is beyond belief to me!

Although it seems extreme, I can see the point; many people in the West have lived far beyond their means for many years and have basically bancrupted their countries, so make them pay for it. I was recently talking to a relation of mine from the UK and he said to me, " It was great before, every time you needed some money, you just re-mortgaged your house".
You shouldn't tax savers though, I would tax those in dept who caused this present financial crisis.

[MrPlum]

You shouldn't tax savers though

What tax? This is legalized robber-baron style plunder.

[easyas]

To be honest GN, I'd be as worried about this happening in Spain:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-21814325

Its a news story, that whilst true, is beyond belief to me!

Although it seems extreme, I can see the point; many people in the West have lived far beyond their means for many years and have basically bancrupted their countries, so make them pay for it. I was recently talking to a relation of mine from the UK and he said to me, " It was great before, every time you needed some money, you just re-mortgaged your house".
You shouldn't tax savers though, I would tax those in dept who caused this present financial crisis.

If already in debt they'd have to take out a loan to pay for any tax. Defeats the object of the exercise!

[STEVE G]

You shouldn't tax savers though

What tax? This is legalized robber-baron style plunder.

There seems to be some sort of collective amnesia going on to why the West is in such a financial mire. Bankers and politicians might have facilitated the problem but all those private individuals who treated the property bubble as free money are the real villains of the plot.
If all the people buying, selling and remortgaging property had done something sensible with the money, reinvested it or started businesses or whatever, there wouldn't be a problem now but the vast majority of them used it to simply live beyond their means.
I agree that it's hard to do but in principal, what is wrong with the idea of getting those who caused the problem to pay for the damage?

[Bristolian]

Are you really saying that for the majority of homeowners, that that simply purchased a home to live in, that they caused the problem??

I like many, bought a home to live in and not for speculation.

Please can you expand your thoughts and explain why normal home buyers might be to blame? I really do not understand this reasoning.

[MrPlum]

what is wrong with the idea of getting those who caused the problem to pay for the damage?

In a representative democracy you are supposed to convince the peasants to vote for their own executioners before wielding the axe. This time they have simply plundered private savings without any warning.

I do agree in principal but deal with it at source. The great unwashed would never have been given 'liars loans' if mortgage companies, Wall St., and banks hadn't colluded to strip away regulation, then packaged mortgages as investments, giving them phony AAA ratings, then turning billion-dollar losses into trillion-dollar losses via fractional reserve jiggery-pokery.

The middle class in the U.S. and in bankrupted countries have been decimated. Millions of homes repossessed, millions more on food stamps and unemployed. You aren't really talking about honest money and honest debt. Only odious debt.

I agree with Carlin. They are coming for our savings, pensions and anything else legalized plunder will give them. Protest and the security state is waiting to club you like baby seals.

[Bristolian]

They are coming for our savings, pensions and anything else legalized plunder will give them. Protest and the security state is waiting to club you like baby seals.

"Ain't that the truth"

[STEVE G]

Are you really saying that for the majority of homeowners, that that simply purchased a home to live in, that they caused the problem??

I like many, bought a home to live in and not for speculation.

Please can you expand your thoughts and explain why normal home buyers might be to blame? I really do not understand this reasoning.

No, obviously if you just brought a house to live, that is not a problem. It was the rampant speculation on property that is the source of much of the Wests ills and people spending the proceeds in unproductive ways rather than reinvesting it.

[easyas]

Are you really saying that for the majority of homeowners, that that simply purchased a home to live in, that they caused the problem??

I like many, bought a home to live in and not for speculation.

Please can you expand your thoughts and explain why normal home buyers might be to blame? I really do not understand this reasoning.

Sadly, whilst you might be a "normal home buyer" many many more than you were not! For a while I pursued the trade of a mortgage broker (shame, shame, hiss, hiss!) and I was guilty of aiding and abetting the greed of many people in Australia who believed the property bubble would last forever (and who was I to disillusion them?) and cashed in their "gains" by remortgaging and buying whatever - a yacht, a second or even a third car, or even a second or third home with the credit they were afforded by the Banks. I'm not talking just about fringe Banks, I'm talking about ALL Banks. They ditched any responsibility they previously had to ensure the borrower had the capability of meeting the repayment criteria of any loan by introducing first of all "Low Doc" loans (meaning the prospective borrower was only obliged to supply minimal evidence of a capacity to pay, knowing full well that that whatever they supplied would remain unchecked by the Broker or the Bank) and subsequently when their own Bank's "loan book balance" suffered in comparison to other Banks they introduced "No Doc" loans - anyone like to guess how difficult they were to obtain? Not easy of course if you continued to believe you were a "normal home buyer" but incredibly easy if you were prepared to lie through your teeth and sign a loan application attesting you knew what you had entered yourself into and that you had the means to service it. A "No Doc" meant no bank statements, tax assessments or any other income related items had to be supplied. The Bank happily gave you the money!
The Broker and the Bank relied on the borrower's honesty - but none of us queried it! Why, because loans of this nature provided income to the Broker and profit to the Banks. Only when the bubble burst, as it did initially big time in the States where greed is King, subsequently in the UK, Australia, Spain, Greece and everywhere else did the chickens come home to roost!
Bristolian you say you are a "normal home buyer". Do you know what your property might have been valued at, say 3 or 4 years ago and what it is now valued at? I truly hope you resisted the temptation to buy that second car, that villa in Majorca, that whatever!

[caller]

For the UK, I think its just too simplistic to talk about re-mortgaging as the big issue. The self-declaration thing which pretty much all banks and building societies introduced was very widely abused, with the banks making no checks whatsoever as to the truth of what had been declared.

Thiis was aided by unsrupulous brokers who helped folk fill in their applications. In my line of work, we came across scams on what had been declared time and again, when even the most cursory check would have been sufficient to identify the scam - such as did the employer actually exist!

It was a farce of the banks own making and they, in my opinion, whould be held responsible for that. Obviously thats all stopped now.

I've only re-mortgaged once in my life for a relatively small sum which was easily affordable and I believe that applies to the majority of mortgaged home owners, because ultimately, you have to pay it back!