Grief - How do you deal with it?

[JD]

From another Section of HHAD

I know this happens thousands of times everyday to folks who are not celebrities, but published events like this drives home how difficult it is to tell a child Mom or Dad is not coming home anymore. Next most difficult is to tell a Mom or Dad their child is gone.

This has prompted me to start a new thread.

By the way Pete, I would transpose your final remark. The first, will in time, bring the family unit closer together, the second tends to, most of the time, tear the parents apart, both types of grief need a different approach when councelling, also children are much stronger than adults.

I used to do a bit grievance councelling in the U.K. One of the reasons for leaving blighty was to get a break from this. It takes it’s toll eventually. And as someone who has suffered this on a personal basis, (mother, brother, son and friend), I would always end up taking this grief home with me, as a remembrance of how I felt at the time. Even after the help and advice I gave them, it always seemed to knock me sideways.

I am currently councelling a friend of mine via the Internet who has just lost his second child through leukaemia. (his first son died in a canoeing accident off Calshot Spit a few years ago). This loss of his coincides with the anniversary of my own losses at this time of year (August - September), it has opened a lot of old wounds but is also therapeutic. Hence my wayward and overtly soppy posts of late.

How do others cope with these things when so far away from family & loved ones?

You can feel alone in your grief sometimes, even when surrounded by friends and associates, and when you have helped others, it often results in you needing an ear yourself to warm.

People get so wrapped up in their own problems sometimes that they fail to see your needs. I was talking to a lady who’s dog had died in England once. She was devastated, she bought the pup from me some three years previous and called me when the dog got hit by a car and had to be put down. I was sat in her living room helping her with the same advice you would as for a child’s death. (That is how it felt for her, living alone with her dog). Her neighbour came in through the kitchen door, and said “Sorry about your dogâ€

[Georgy Porgy]

Particularly timely post - personality Steve Irwin, the crocodile man, died tragically yesterday and the papers and TV are full of it in UK, USA and Australia.

Back to the post - grief is one of those "awkward" themes, and as foreigners living abroad we should be even more mindful of our new friends and neighbours. We need to watch out for mates who are down for any reason and who may need a quiet chat, because of a loss of some kind

Another kind of "grief" is felt by people who get homesick - kids and adults, for the things they left back home, and there is no extended link with family and old friends to share with.

The stages of grief are also worked through in divorce and house removal - get familiar with the process (google "grief") and learn to slot in where needed.

Guys tend to have a beer with their mates. What do women do about this sort of thing, especially farang ladies in HH, any idea?

[DawnHRD]

Speaking for myself, I just got on with things. My father committed suicide in BKK 4 years ago, leaving my Mum a devastated widow & me a very angry woman who had to sort out such things as the police insisting (after the cremation, so hardly for ID purposes) that we view the photos of my father's broken body (He jumped from a height). I saw them, but managed to spare Mum.
6 months ago, my boyfriend died, unexpectedly, leaving me with his little son. About a month after that my Grandfather died of lung cancer. In between all these, we've had quite a few dogs die, which always affects Mum & I quite badly, as well. Even now, we cry over every dog that dies.
I had counselling after Dad died, as I got quite destructively angry, but Mum chose to deal with his death in her own way. For Du's & Granda's deaths, neither of us has had any professional help, and we've been responsible for littl'un's understanding of the situation & emotional health.
The worst thing is having no-one to talk to. People will talk for about as long as the funeral proceedings & then get bored of you. So, you shut up. You try & get on with life & deal with (or more likely suppress) your grief. Mum & I are "lucky" in that we have both felt the loss of these 3 men in our lives and can talk to each other. It would be a very hard thing to bear completely alone.

[JW]

My mother died in September 1999, she had an inoperable brain tumour which turned cancerous and killed her within a few weeks. She was 47 and more like a sister to me, it was the worst day of my life.
The family seemed to take it very hard and i felt that i couldnt show any grief in front of people - more so family than friends. I took a few days off work then got straight back to work as if nothing had happened.
I only realised around a year later at an appraisal with my boss (a great friend and very supportive) that my work had been affected quite a lot, i had become lazy and didnt really care (i had always really taken care of my customers) about anything. This meeting brought home the fact that i had been a) socialising too much - pissing it up!(Didnt like to go home to an empty house and find myself thinking too much).
b) not really accepted the change in my life.
I still think about her all of the time and certain things may get me a little upset - certain music that mam loved is a sure way of setting me off (tracks mentioned in the music that makes you think thread).
Look back now and have to take the positives of it all, i have agreat life here with a good job, great friends and great country - non of this would have happened if i hadnt lost my best friend.

[matthew80]

This is a very interesting thread. It seems that Western culture is hesitant to discuss death and the grieving process. I have yet to experience that "deep rooted, soul-cutting grief" that comes with the loss of a close relative: mother, father, sister, brother. But my parents (who are like best friends to me) are quite elderly and experiencing health problems. I know the time is coming, and I have no idea how I will deal with it. To think about the inevitable fills me with sadness. But that's all part of living, I reckon. Take time to appreciate everything and everyone in your life! Change is continual.

[Wanderlust]

matthew80,
I am in the same boat as you - I have lost all my grandparents and my uncle in my teens, but now my parents are getting on, although relatively healthy and active; Dad is 82, Mum 79. They are back in the UK while I am over here, with the next trip home not due until May next year for my Mum's 80th. My sister is in the UK and sees them regularly, and we all have a webcam link up every Sunday, but when the time comes it is almost inevitable that I will be in Thailand, so not only will I feel the grief of losing a parent, I will also feel guilty for not being there to help my sister. I really don't know how it will affect me, although when your parents are elderly I guess it must be somewhat easier to cope with - my Dad always says when someone dies at a ripe old age, 'Well they had a good innings' and in some ways that is how one should try to look at it I suppose. My big dread is what happens if my Mum goes first, as she is still the archetypal housewife and does everything for my Dad, and I think he will fall apart without her - they have been married for well over 50 years.
I agree that this is an important topic which we should all speak about from time to time; thanks to JD for starting it.

[lomuamart]

Ditto WL.
My folks are both the same age - 76 - and so far healthy.
But as the years go by, I can't help finding myself thinking about how I'll react when I get the dreaded phone call/email.
At least I'll be seeing them both again in three days, this time with my wife who they havn't met before. We're both looking forward to a good visit.

[Ken]

A good topic. From my own experience, having lost both my parents in the last 10 years, I find that it still hurts just as much but the pain comes less often. I used to get upset when I would dream off them and wake up and realise it was only a dream. I counter that by being positive and am thankful that I can still have them in my life, in my memory and my dreams.

[Winkie]

Shit.... I need a beer after reading all this!

[PeteC]

I lost my Dad in 1994 at the age of 83. Then my Mom in 2000 at the age of 88 after a second stroke. My oldest sister had been caring for both of them for the better part of 20 years as their health started to decline.

Was living in Hawaii at the time of my Mom's death in mid April and had returned there from the funeral in Philadelphia and was dealing with my grief and trying to get back on track.

Received a call from my brother at 0630 on June 20 that my sister mentioned above had died in her sleep at age 63. I was very close to her as she was 12 when I was born and very instrumental in helping raise me. Here she was just released from 20 years of caring for others and starting to enjoy here retirement, and she's gone just like that.

I still don't think I'm over all that. When each April rolls around I am a mess until after June 20. I'm a mess again right now talking about all of this, damn. Is this therpy? I think not, at least for me. Maybe I'm not ready to accept those events and never will be. Where the hell is the beer. Pete

[DawnHRD]

Know just what you mean, Pete, about getting upset, just thinking about it and wondering if the talking is therapy, or not? When I wrote my post this morning, I was crying my eyes out. Mum walked in just as I clicked "submit" and it took me 5 mins to contain myself enough to explain what was wrong. When I read her my post, she started crying too.

[richard]

A very good thread

My experiences are similar.

Both my parents died whilst I was overseas. My mother died whilst I was working in Zimbabwe and I couldn't get home in time. My fathere died whist I was here and there was no way I could get home in time, as in both cases it was sudden. Mind you they both lived well into their 90's (my father was waiting for telgram from the Queen). So grieving was more akin to guilt that I had not been there. I'm sure everyone who knows he on deaths doorstep would want loved ones around at the finish

Now of course the boot is on the other foot. My brother and my 2 daughters are wondering about my demise and what they are to do. This was exacabated by my recent illness over here. I contracted DVT and of course San Paulo hadn't a clue. A good friend of mine rushed me up to the Bumrungrad who immediately put me into intensive care. I recovered but are destined remain on Warfarin for the rest of my days. (Unless I give up booze and fags)

It reoccured again after I stupidly had a massage on the leg. Got to a point where I couldn't sit down or lie down. So one evening I just told the g/f to go to bed and I was going stand up until I collapsed. She ordered a taxi and swept me back up to Bangkok. They diagnosed that the massage had disturbed the clot and it had travelled up through my heart to my lung. The nurses were amazed I'd recovered.

Back to what someone said earlier about now and again we think of our own problems rather than family and friends.

Enough of my rantings. I do however, take heart from the Thais. I've been to 3 Isaan funerals and have been amazed at their cultural/religious thinking. The Thai funeral tends to be a three day event. First day is the arrival of relatives and private grieving. The second day involves the village and friends with monks chanting all day. The third day is party time with discos etc........ WHY? Well they know you have passed on but if you've been a good person you are to be reborn back to a good status

[caller]

A tough thread!

I was 21 when my father died after a heart attack and then a stroke a few months later. He probably didn't want to carry on, he said that to me, not my mum. A bright guy, forced to work rather than take up a scholarship for further education, he suffered in WW2 which profoundely affected the rest of his life. Then got made redundant after 25 years in a state job and he never recovered from that either. We're not from the north of England either!

He used to laugh at the war films when a single shot would blow a mine up, when he actually worked on minesweepers - wooden - and the plural is deliberate, they got blown up! He said the whole ships Co. would be firing at the things trying to blow them up and they would usually end up pushing it away with a broom!

Mum died in 94 after being diagnosed with lung cancer 12 months earlier. I nursed her for most of that time until as a Son I was doing things no Son should have to do. My own health suffered during this period. My sister then travelled back from her home abroad and basically took over. This was all planned and worked well.

Now, I just have a few elderly relatives I'm not really in touch with, loads of cousins I don't see. 3 Nephews I am close to, and my sister & BIL in Oz.

Not to forget my wife and step-son!

I feel somewhat spared from having to look after elderly relatives, as harsh as that may seem, but I don't regret that.

The wierdest thing is that I do have regular dreams where my parents are part of my current life. Thats an odd one that I'm sure a psychoanalyst would have a field day with?

What I regret is is missing the support my Dad would have given me - we were just becoming mates, if that makes sense? I remember with pride the day he took me down his local for the first time, "c'mon son, do ypu fancy a beer" - not that I wasn't used to going into pubs by then - and his friends said, "is this your boy then, George"! I could see his pride in that (God knows why) and I still sit as he did in a pub chair.

Just my tale.

[Jaime]

It seems that Western culture is hesitant to discuss death and the grieving process

I'm not sure I agree with that. I think we are very open about such things in the western world and often mourn deeply, and publicly. Traditionally we question everything and, in more recent times, we have come to analyse everything to the 'n'th degree as well. Generally we seem able to empathise with others very well and in most western countries counselling others in times of grief, debt, crisis etc. is valued so highly that counselling institutions are established as part of our societies.

This thread is testament to the empathy, openness and warmth that are part of our ethos for living here in the west. That is certainly my reality.

[matthew80]

A bit off topic (hmm..it's a pretty large topic..) but this thread has got me thinking about my wonderful elderly parents, and about how I shall react when the inevitable occurs. Seems to me that for much of my life they took care of me in every way possible: emotional and finacial support especially. Now they are getting on, getting frail, suffering various ailments, and of course I worry constantly. It is my responsibility now to take care of them, when the time comes when they need such care. I feel some measure of guilt about this - as I am pretty far-flung. (I live on the other side of Canada from them..huge distance) As well, I am drawn to Thailand when I am on holiday, and I wish to retire or continue my career as an educator there someday. I feel dispicable at the thought that I might experience a sense of "relief" or "freedom" when they ultimately pass on. Is that horrible or what! I guess the idea that my parents won't be around forever really upsets me sometimes. It's like suffering "Pre-Grief-Grief" - possibly a new stage in the grieving process? Anyway, a great thread. Thanks for the sincerety and humanity in the posts. I think it is good to talk about this once in a while - if only to realize that others experience the same feelings. That's comforting. But on to happier musings!