Treadmill interferes with internet connection

[hhfarang]

Wow, this was a weird one and I thought it was the usual 3BB problems until it happened every time so I drew a correlation and looked it up.

A while back I bought a treadmill. I like to watch TV news when on an exercise machine but where I'm living now that is not possible. The treadmill is in the same room as my computer so I thought, no problem, I can just watch streaming news while on the treadmill. I would sit in front of the computer for a couple of hours doing other stuff with the streaming news running in the background with no problems, then when I decided to hop on the treadmill, within seconds the news stream would go into that circling arrow in the middle of the screen and lose the feed.

As I said, I thought it was just another 3BB problem, but after noticing it happening every time I ran some experiments and it does happen within a minute after I turn on the treadmill (belt running) every time without fail.

I admittedly don't know anything about electricity, but I know there are at least a few experts on here (Nereus?, petercr?) so I thought I'd ask the question. I looked up the problem on the internet and found a tech forum thread that talks about this very problem.

http://forums.cnet.com/7723-7583_102-38 ... dsl-modem/

I don't want to mess with the grounding, nor try to run an extension cord to the other side of the house (it's such a small house it's probably all one circuit anyway) so the best option, if it will work, would be the "line noise filter" mentioned in the fifth post down from the top. That talks about an AC line noise filter because it probably is an American forum. I believe the current here is DC so is there such a line noise filter for DC current?

I don't know what a line noise filter is, what it looks like, or if they sell them here or how much they are so I'm asking for recommendations. Do you guys think one of these will fix the problem? If so, where do I get it and what type/size do I need. If not, any other suggestions of ways that may solve this interference?

Thanks

[Frank Hovis]

I don't want to mess with the grounding ... about an AC line noise filter because it probably is an American forum. I believe the current here is DC so is there such a line noise filter for DC current?

You absolutely don't want to mess with any electrical stuff if you think the supply here is DC. The supply here is AC 220-230V @ 50Hz. (To be read in a keep yourself safe voice despite probably sounding alarmist and condescending).

You could try running the router/modem off an unplugged UPS (uninterruptable power supply) if you have one, that would free it from possible interference on the power line.

Does your treadmill have BlueTooth for monitoring things? I get a warning on my computer to turn off Bluetooth as it may interfere with wireless transmissions. I've never noticed it interfering though.

[dtaai-maai]

Simple solution, hhf - stop exercising.

[Nereus]

I cannot open your link, so have not read what they have to say. However, the electric supply here is AC, not DC. BUT, on every treadmill that I have had the misfortune to work on they use a SCR (silicon controlled rectifier) to vary the supply voltage to a DC motor for speed control. These things are notorious for producing spikes or "glitches" which are reflected back into the supply AC line. Most electronic equipment does not take to kindly to this interference and will act accordingly.

An AC line filter MAY stop it, if you can find one that does what it is supposed to do, and any of them will work better if they have a proper ground wire.

[PeteC]

Treadmill interferes with DSL modem

by KahawaSukari - 3/7/10 3:20 PM

I recently discovered that it has been my treadmill that has been causing my modem to go bezerk and lose internet connection. Same treadmill was causing static on phone. Bypassing ground (third prong) connection on t'mill fixed that, but DSL interference continues.
Any ideas on how to fix. In UK someone suggests a Tacima Line Conditioner/Filter. What about a USA 110/120 v product?

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Are these devices on the same circuit?

by Steven Haninger - 3/7/10 4:31 PM

In Reply to: Treadmill interferes with DSL modem by KahawaSukari

I have to think the treadmill motor/speed control might be kicking heavy amounts of induction current or back EMF into your local AC lines. It might help to move something to an outlet that's on a different xformer phase but can't say for sure. If you can't do that, I'd think the simplest solution might be a conditioner such as is commonly sold for some AV applications. APC (American Power Conversion) makes such and Tripplite is another common name in the US that offers a variety of power stabilization products. I'm also thinking it wasn't good to defeat the ground on the treadmill. You could possibly add a couple of filter capacitors. I can't come up with proper values but you'd need one from both the hot and neutral sides going to ground. A google search for controlling back EMF and DC motor induction for ideas more expert than mine.

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Thanks

by KahawaSukari - 3/8/10 6:54 AM

In Reply to: Are these devices on the same circuit? by Steven Haninger

I will try powering one of the pieces via extension cord from the other side of the house, or the porch. Those should be different circuits. Still, I think all the power is common and if the interference is transmitted through the lines, it will be throughout. I'll check. I don't know beans about capacitors and such!

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If treadmill is the only problem, then...

by ahtoi - 3/8/10 11:17 AM

In Reply to: Thanks by KahawaSukari

I would think there is an easy fix. Don't exercise and surf the net at the same time, hehe. Just want to say that the treadmill may not be the ONLY causes. DSL..I been there.

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That's a tough problem

by Steven Haninger - 3/8/10 2:14 PM

In Reply to: Thanks by KahawaSukari

You'd need an O-scope and line monitor to see the effects of the treadmill on your AC and work out a solution. As for just moving to another outlet, you may have to try more than one because you actually have two taps from the transformer coming into your house and you'd have to try the other tap. The neutral would be common to both so you can't do much with that. Filter capacitors, certain types of diodes, etc. can shunt or block transients but that's not for most do-it-your-selfers. Good luck.

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Thanks

by KahawaSukari - 3/8/10 3:21 PM

In Reply to: That's a tough problem by Steven Haninger

The treadmill maker is going to send me an AC line noise filter, free of charge, shipping paid. 'Sounds to me like they know that there is a problem, although, they said that their equipment complies with this and that. It should prevent interference with AM radio (guess I can't workout and listen to radio in the evenings). We'll see if it solves the DSL problem. Should have the filter in about a week.

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(NT) Sounds like a plan. Thanks for letting us know

by Steven Haninger - 3/8/10 4:31 PM

In Reply to: Thanks by KahawaSukari


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Filtration problem

by CatboatMonte - 12/29/12 2:18 PM

In Reply to: Treadmill interferes with DSL modem by KahawaSukari

I have the same problem: Schwinn treadmill and AT&T Netgear B90 DSL modem. When the treadmill runs, access to the Internet stops. Turn off the treadmill, and connectivity resumes. It is plain that the treadmill causes interference.

Using an extension cord, I plugged the treadmill into an outlet 40 feet away (different circuit). This worked, but I don't want to use an extension cord nor move the treadmill.

Finally, my wife tried the DSL filter dongle from our original (now broken) 2WIRE modem. This is the part that connects between the DSL modem and the wall phone jack. It worked. Apparently, the Pace American filters supplied with the AT&T Netgear modems are simply junk.

Monte

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Treadmill Disconnecting DSL, Additional Symptoms

by rwadecole - 9/28/13 3:21 PM

In Reply to: Filtration problem by CatboatMonte

Hi Folks,
I also have this very strange problem where a treadmill on the opposite side of the house, about 60 feet away in another room, knocks out my Netgear N300 ADSL2+ DSL (only temporarily) when the treadmill motor/belt is turned on. Wifi connections from devices to the router stay connected. It's the actual DSL that is disrupted, because the internet light turns red. After the treadmill runs for about a minute, the internet light turns green again and connectivity is restored.

Here is what I have done to try and fix the problem:
1. Wrapped the power cords to the modem-router and the treadmill with RF chokes.
2. Modem-router is on a battery backup unit.
3. Wired a new totally separate, isolated CAT5 connection from the telco box outside the house, around the house to my office.
4. I even tried unplugging the modem/router from the wall so it was running purely from the battery backup unit.

But starting the treadmill still temporarily knocked out the DSL!

I can't think of what else to try! All I can imagine now, is that the treadmill is leaking some kind of radiation into the environment when it starts up which gets into the modem circuitry... but as I mentioned, they are at least 60 feet apart!

Another odd symptom is that if you start the treadmill, run for a while, turn it completely off, and then turn it back on while it is "warmed up", it doesn't knock out DSL.

Any ideas? Any similar observations?

Regards,
Wade

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Just an idea,

by Oldartq - 9/29/13 1:19 PM

In Reply to: Treadmill Disconnecting DSL, Additional Symptoms by rwadecole

The treadmill start up could cause excessive noise or...maybe big line voltage drop. line voltage regulator probably isn't cheap (I am guessing). I gave up my DSL when I can't find out why the thing turns off between 8-11 pm. I was lucky to have cable service in my area.

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Thanks for the idea...

by rwadecole - 9/29/13 3:33 PM

In Reply to: Just an idea, by Oldartq

All ideas are appreciated! The problem isn't line voltage drop though, because during some of my experiments I was running the dsl router purely from the battery backup unit, with the unit unplugged from the wall. Interestingly, I read another thread about putting an AM radio tuned to 1400Mhz near the suspected source of the interference, and indeed, there was a noticeable change in the static feedback at the moment the treadmill started.

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Just an idea.

by R. Proffitt Moderator - 9/29/13 3:49 PM

In Reply to: Treadmill interferes with DSL modem by KahawaSukari

Just in case it is line interference, if you have more than a few calls to their support ask them to try what the industry calls a "homerun" to the DSL model. My neighbor after months of trouble had a tech that was a little better and that's what they did.
Bob

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RE Just an idea...

by rwadecole - 9/29/13 5:52 PM

In Reply to: Just an idea. by R. Proffitt Moderator

Thanks Mr. Proffitt... that's exactly what I did -- I ran a new dedicated line straight from the NID to my DSL jack. To my understanding, that's the definition of a Home Run in the context of DSL. Unfortunately, that didn't help. But thanks anyway!

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That's easy to tell if you got it right.

by R. Proffitt Moderator - 9/29/13 10:47 PM

In Reply to: RE Just an idea... by rwadecole

With the homerun you don't need any DSL filters.
Bob

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[STEVE G]

Yes, I've just had a look on the net and it seems to be a very common problem judging by the number of answers you get and I see a lot of suggestions of using a decent quality surge suppressor with built in rf/emi filtering.

[hhfarang]

Simple solution, hhf - stop exercising.

Thanks, DM, best suggestion and the one I was looking for.

You absolutely don't want to mess with any electrical stuff if you think the supply here is DC. The supply here is AC 220-230V @ 50Hz. (To be read in a keep yourself safe voice despite probably sounding alarmist and condescending).

I told you I don't know anything about electricity so no, nothing sounds condescending, especially relating to the supply here where my lack of knowledge has been proven by the electric company selling me a transformer about ten times the size of what I needed (so they could use it to power the rest of the village!) and by my near death experience when my gate motor went bad and fed current into the gate itself.

Anyway, you mentioned using a UPS unplugged? I have one of those on my TV/PVR so that it continues to record during the frequent short power outages we have here. In the forum link I posted someone said that didn't work, which sounds even more weird:

All ideas are appreciated! The problem isn't line voltage drop though, because during some of my experiments I was running the dsl router purely from the battery backup unit, with the unit unplugged from the wall. Interestingly, I read another thread about putting an AM radio tuned to 1400Mhz near the suspected source of the interference, and indeed, there was a noticeable change in the static feedback at the moment the treadmill started.

You mentioned Bluetooth. I don't know how this is done, but the machine has a wireless heart monitor that communicates with a strap worn around my chest. Could that signal be the problem?
I'll do some more experiments but I do believe it's motor feedback on the line as Nereus mentioned because simply powering on the treadmill doesn't seem to have an effect. It happens when I hit "go" and the motor starts to move the belt (however that could also be when the signal from the heart monitor starts).

So what about an AC line noise filter that was mentioned in that thread I posted. Think that would work? And when I look them up they look like something an electrician needs to install. I was hoping for something like an extension cord that I could plug the modem or treadmill into one side and the other into the wall socket that would eliminate the interference being in the middle. Surely there must be some relatively simple way to solve this problem.

[Chromeman]

A good surge protector with filtering is always a good idea to use on expensive and sensitive electronic equipment like computers.

I have my computers and NAS on such equipment, including the network itself. The ADSL modem from the phone company is on the outside, but the cable from it to my router goes via the surge protector. It even has the option to use it on old fashioned phone lines if I had used that.

Since I started using the surge protector, I have never had problems after irregularities on the power lines due to thunder storms or other things. But I do have several friends who have had computers, routers etc. died after lightning strikes in the power grid.

[hhfarang]

^ Chromeman, yes I've been meaning to pick up another UPS/surge protector for my computer and modem. I moved the one I was using on the computer to the TV/PVR as it has a large expensive hard drive that I was worried about.

I just noticed this in that thread I posted.

...DSL filter dongle from our original (now broken) 2WIRE modem. This is the part that connects between the DSL modem and the wall phone jack. It worked.

This sounds like a filter that goes into the phone line (for the modem) and not the electrical line. I wonder if those are available locally. Also, that makes it sound like a UPS/surge protector like Chromeman mentioned may work if it is of the type that has the phone jack in it too.

[Siani]

HHF..... I too have had some problems. Not with a treadmill though...although I always seem to be on one

In the UK I am with BT Broadband. I live in a block of 5 apartments which is on 2 floors. Whenever the lift is in use it would interrupt my broadband and not reconnect for about 5 minutes . The broadband is used communally for all 5 apartments. I decided to "go alone" with having my own broadband installed. Even now the lift still interferes with that but not for very long, maybe half a minute.

[hhfarang]

Well, problem solved by a cheap but messy method that didn't seem to work for others on that forum thread I posted. I went and got one of those industrial spooled 50 meter extension cords and plugged the treadmill into the farthest outlet that I could on the opposite side of my house.

Just finished an hour on the treadmill with no interruption of my streaming service, even during a thunderstorm so a double whammy!

So it works, but I have to leave the door open a crack wasting aircon as the cord will not fit underneath. I'll still be looking for a better solution but problem solved for the moment (with what I'd call a Thai workaround) .

Thanks for all your suggestions and help... especially yours DM.

[STEVE G]

Well, problem solved by a cheap but messy method that didn't seem to work for others on that forum thread I posted. I went and got one of those industrial spooled 50 meter extension cords and plugged the treadmill into the farthest outlet that I could on the opposite side of my house.

I know this might sound mad but try using the extension lead on an outlet in the same room as your treadmill as it's just possible that the coiled cable on the reel is acting as a crude RF choke.
I'm just guessing but give it a try and see what happens.

[hhfarang]

Thanks Steve, I'll try that and let you know if it works.