Electric Vehicles (EV) Thread

[STEVE G]

Scandinavian countries are really going for it:

Sweden Hits 62% Plugin EV Market Share In May, Tesla Model Y High
https://cleantechnica.com/2023/06/03/sw ... -high/amp/

Norwegian new vehicle emissions plunge as plug-in electrics hit stunning 91% market share
https://thedriven.io/2023/06/02/norwegi ... ket-share/

[2/cb]

Scandinavian countries are really going for it:

Sweden Hits 62% Plugin EV Market Share In May, Tesla Model Y High
https://cleantechnica.com/2023/06/03/sw ... -high/amp/

Norwegian new vehicle emissions plunge as plug-in electrics hit stunning 91% market share
https://thedriven.io/2023/06/02/norwegi ... ket-share/

Given freedom of choice, few choose the EV option. Because they are inferior to petrol.

[STEVE G]

^That can hardly be the case when the best selling car in the world is currently an EV.

[Dannie Boy]

Scandinavian countries are really going for it:

Sweden Hits 62% Plugin EV Market Share In May, Tesla Model Y High
https://cleantechnica.com/2023/06/03/sw ... -high/amp/

Norwegian new vehicle emissions plunge as plug-in electrics hit stunning 91% market share
https://thedriven.io/2023/06/02/norwegi ... ket-share/

Given freedom of choice, few choose the EV option. Because they are inferior to petrol.

Would you like to quantify that statement?

[HHTel]

An EV directly converts electricity into movement. This makes it far more efficient than a conventional car, which has to burn fuel (creating heat) and then convert that heat into motion. Did you know that an EV can be more than 70% efficient from the moment you turn it on?

Research has shown that electric cars are better for the environment. They emit fewer greenhouse gases and air pollutants than petrol or diesel cars. And this takes into account their production and electricity generation to keep them running.

Generally speaking, electric cars last longer than their gas counterparts (and require less maintenance, too!). So picking up a sleek new electric vehicle (EV) might be your best bet

Electric vehicles (EVs) have fewer moving parts than gas-powered cars. That mechanical simplicity, advocates say, should lead to fewer part failures — and more reliable vehicles — over time.

Just saying!

[2/cb]

An EV directly converts electricity into movement. This makes it far more efficient than a conventional car, which has to burn fuel (creating heat) and then convert that heat into motion. Did you know that an EV can be more than 70% efficient from the moment you turn it on?

Research has shown that electric cars are better for the environment. They emit fewer greenhouse gases and air pollutants than petrol or diesel cars. And this takes into account their production and electricity generation to keep them running.

Generally speaking, electric cars last longer than their gas counterparts (and require less maintenance, too!). So picking up a sleek new electric vehicle (EV) might be your best bet

Electric vehicles (EVs) have fewer moving parts than gas-powered cars. That mechanical simplicity, advocates say, should lead to fewer part failures — and more reliable vehicles — over time.

Just saying!

And yet…in a free market, few would choose an EV. They are more expensive, depreciate heavily, most are severely range-limited, and there real issues with breakdowns, reliability and fires. The EV brigade are delusional. You can spend your money where you want; just leave the rest of us alone. Thanks.

[KhunLA]

And yet…in a free market, few would choose an EV. They are more expensive, depreciate heavily, most are severely range-limited, and there real issues with breakdowns, reliability and fires. The EV brigade are delusional. You can spend your money where you want; just leave the rest of us alone. Thanks.

Your post show how delusional some ICE owners are.
... not more expensive
... don't depreciate heavily, market dependent
... range is getting better at affordable prices (relative)
... electric motor out last ICEs w/less maintenance
... very reliable
... less fires than ICEs per 100k vehicles

Do agree with part of you post:
"You can spend your money where you want; just leave the rest of us alone. Thanks"

[Dannie Boy]

And yet…in a free market, few would choose an EV. They are more expensive, depreciate heavily, most are severely range-limited, and there real issues with breakdowns, reliability and fires. The EV brigade are delusional. You can spend your money where you want; just leave the rest of us alone. Thanks.

Your post show how delusional some ICE owners are.
... not more expensive - there are not many cars where you can make a direct comparison, but in the UK Kia offer their Niro model in Hybrid, PHEV and full electric - the most expensive is the full electric!!
... don't depreciate heavily, market dependent - they definitely do in some markets and it’s model specific some EV cars depreciate less than average, some more.
... range is getting better at affordable prices (relative) - agreed, although the breakthrough will come with solid state batteries.
... electric motor out last ICEs w/less maintenance - agreed
... very reliable - the jury is out on this one - this report suggests otherwise https://www.carscoops.com/2022/03/ice-c ... udy-shows/
... less fires than ICEs per 100k vehicles - agreed

Do agree with part of you post:
"You can spend your money where you want; just leave the rest of us alone. Thanks"

Please see my comments against your individual points above.

[Gregjam]

Good to see that points are being raised and countered rather than developing into a slanging match. If I was in the market for a new vehicle I would consider an EV and make a balanced decision. As it is my three year old PPV will continue to be used until it would be cheaper to replace it again taking all factors into consideration including the opinion of ‘her who shall be obeyed’ which is very rarely rational or logical.
Must say that I am seeing more and more charging points at service stations but wonder if in quoting costs EV owners include the cost of coffee, meals and snacks that are consumed while waiting for their steeds to be charged rather than be able to continue with their trip or eat at a cheaper venue.

[KhunLA]

Good to see that points are being raised and countered rather than developing into a slanging match. If I was in the market for a new vehicle I would consider an EV and make a balanced decision. As it is my three year old PPV will continue to be used until it would be cheaper to replace it again taking all factors into consideration including the opinion of ‘her who shall be obeyed’ which is very rarely rational or logical.
Must say that I am seeing more and more charging points at service stations but wonder if in quoting costs EV owners include the cost of coffee, meals and snacks that are consumed while waiting for their steeds to be charged rather than be able to continue with their trip or eat at a cheaper venue.

After 3+ hrs on the road, they're going to be consumed by us, whether stopping to top up the EV or not.

[KhunLA]

Khun LA wrote:
... not more expensive - there are not many cars where you can make a direct comparison, but in the UK Kia offer their Niro model in Hybrid, PHEV and full electric - the most expensive is the full electric!!
... only familiar with Thai market, and start at ฿549k (lower specs), & ฿771k (MG EP) and just a tad more than entry level 'made in TH' ICEs, and considerably less than Japanese imports. Other models, better spec'd and more expensive than TH made entry level, but match or cheaper than same quality Japanese imports
... don't depreciate heavily, market dependent - they definitely do in some markets and it’s model specific some EV cars depreciate less than average, some more.

Please see my comments against your individual points above.

[caller]

only familiar with Thai market, and start at ฿549k (lower specs), & ฿771k (MG EP) and just a tad more than entry level 'made in TH' ICEs, and considerably less than Japanese imports.

But Thailand is an aritificial market. The test will come when/if the Governmet subsidy runs out and any new competition rules might not provide China with 0% income tax - unless they extend that to Japanese cars? Or is it 0% for all EV's?

To be honest, between KhunLA and 2c/b, the reality probably lies somewhere in the middle.

[Dannie Boy]

Khun LA wrote:
... not more expensive - there are not many cars where you can make a direct comparison, but in the UK Kia offer their Niro model in Hybrid, PHEV and full electric - the most expensive is the full electric!!
... only familiar with Thai market, and start at ฿549k (lower specs), & ฿771k (MG EP) and just a tad more than entry level 'made in TH' ICEs, and considerably less than Japanese imports. Other models, better spec'd and more expensive than TH made entry level, but match or cheaper than same quality Japanese imports
... don't depreciate heavily, market dependent - they definitely do in some markets and it’s model specific some EV cars depreciate less than average, some more.

Please see my comments against your individual points above.

I know that you take a very insular look at EV prices, but in the big wide world, prices for EV’s are considerably more expensive than petrol cars.

An extract from the following article,

UK order books for the revised Peugeot 2008 have opened, with the French crossover priced from £24,020 and £36,350 in petrol and electric guises respectively.

https://www.autocar.co.uk/car-news/new- ... -£24020-uk

[KhunLA]

I know that you take a very insular look at EV prices, but in the big wide world, prices for EV’s are considerably more expensive than petrol cars.

An extract from the following article,

UK order books for the revised Peugeot 2008 have opened, with the French crossover priced from £24,020 and £36,350 in petrol and electric guises respectively.

https://www.autocar.co.uk/car-news/new- ... -£24020-uk

As are some of the components that make up the EV vs ICE vehicles.

1 or 2 electric motors that will last longer than the rest of the car, with virtually no maintenance. Along with say 50kWh & up, battery banks, again, no real maintenance required. LFP batteries will last longer than the rest of the car will. 2500 cycles and for our MG, that's 360 kms per cycle, 900k kms, before it degrades to 80% capacity. That's amazing...see below.

Our 10kWh ESSs our my solar system were 90k each. If DIY, probably 75k. So add the ball park price of 5 of those to the ICE cars price, and 1 or 2 electric motors instead of the expensive to constantly fuel to operate, and needing constant maintenance ICEs.

Sadly, many things, whether justifiable or not, things that saves you money, or you can make money with, seems to be more expensive. Or if suddenly in demand, as one non vehicle example, when the hell did fish & chicken become expensive ? As soon as people were told it's a healthier option.

Anything eco friendly seems to be priced above it's true value, just add 'green' or 'organic' to it's name.

I think EVs, due to the components, justify most of the added price, and since long term you save money, they'll keep them high as long as they can. Family cars are reasonably priced, the rest, as ICE cars, can get a bit silly.

Same with solar systems in the west, just silly prices, because they save you money, or, goes against those who seem to control things. Big oil/fossil fuel, aren't given in at all. They will make it as hard as possible for people to stop using their product. Over regulating and taxing has kept their profits in tack.

There in no reason in the 21 Century, we still use oil & gas as a fuel or energy source, instead of solar, wind, hydro, thermal energy.

LFP Battery cycle.png

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[STEVE G]

The die is cast: petrol and diesel engines are dying. The electric age is inevitable
https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfr ... ctric-cars