I'll start a new topic on this rather than hijack the other thread.
Are the signatures demanded by the land office from farangs if their wife purchases land applicable in every case?
Are there anyways around it and how do they know if the wife goes on her own, do they ask for marriage certificates and check if its a farang name?
I presume this is done again to protect the Thais as under Thai law if legally married the farang spouse is entitled to 50% of everything apart from land.
What if the mia farang wanted to secretly buy land on the side? Would the farang still be dragged in to sign (though she'd probably put it in someone elses name)?
Signing legal rights away at the land office
Signing legal rights away at the land office
Who is the happier man, he who has braved the storm of life and lived or he who has stayed securely on shore and merely existed? - Hunter S Thompson
buksida,
I took your comment at 1.54 pm to mean that if a Mia farang had an ID card in the farang name she could not purchase land in that name.
With regard to your query about getting around the necessity to sign your rights away I am confused.
My (my wifes) daughter, even though she is married to a farang, used her ID card in her maiden name to go on the chanote.
They dont ask if you are married. If you have a Thai ID card, as far as I know there is no problem buying land.
If you have a farang name, they presume you are married and then insist on the farang signature.
If, as in daughters case, things go pear shaped, the farang will still have no interest in the land.
So in answer to your query I would say there is no way around it.
I took your comment at 1.54 pm to mean that if a Mia farang had an ID card in the farang name she could not purchase land in that name.
With regard to your query about getting around the necessity to sign your rights away I am confused.
My (my wifes) daughter, even though she is married to a farang, used her ID card in her maiden name to go on the chanote.
They dont ask if you are married. If you have a Thai ID card, as far as I know there is no problem buying land.
If you have a farang name, they presume you are married and then insist on the farang signature.
If, as in daughters case, things go pear shaped, the farang will still have no interest in the land.
So in answer to your query I would say there is no way around it.
You only live once.
Ok, she didnt change her name then to that of the farang after marriage.ozuncle wrote:used her ID card in her maiden name to go on the chanote.
So it looks as if they look at the name then, if its farang sounding they want to see the bugger and make him sign.They dont ask if you are married. If you have a Thai ID card, as far as I know there is no problem buying land.
Who is the happier man, he who has braved the storm of life and lived or he who has stayed securely on shore and merely existed? - Hunter S Thompson
Just a general term, not intended to you personally.ozuncle wrote:You calling me a bugger???????????????
And I was happy to sign.
I have had to sign before and I found it an insult ... "By the way, if your mrs kicks the bucket or leaves you, you still get f-all bwaahahahaha", you can almost hear them laughing.
However I find most Thai government decisions towards farangs insulting!
Who is the happier man, he who has braved the storm of life and lived or he who has stayed securely on shore and merely existed? - Hunter S Thompson
Bit late for me on that one, left my country of origin when I were a whippersnapperozuncle wrote: The only advice I could give anyone is to treat Thailand as a their "holiday home" and retain as much property as you can in your country of origin.
Who is the happier man, he who has braved the storm of life and lived or he who has stayed securely on shore and merely existed? - Hunter S Thompson
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Guess
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This is an interesting situation that up until now had not occurred to me. I was aware that signing contracts with the wife assists the wife to get things like mobile phone contracts, bank loans and vehicle hire purchase deals as they know that with a farang in tow they have a much greater chance of getting the full payment.
As for land is concerned if you can never own it then why sign. The name on the Thai ID card is irrelevant in this case as the land registry will only make the change when both sides have agreed that the funds have been transferred.
The next time this arises I will refuse to sign and see what the outcome is.
I have just been taught an expensive lesson in signing Thai language documents. I made the naive assumption that the agents had read the papers and were only getting me to sign statements that were true. That was not the case and an eagle eyed immigration officer spotted the untruths and under questioning and telling the truth it transpired that I had signed false statements.
With regards land though I cannot see who could gain over a signature for something that the law does not let you own and has no relevance to the wife even in the event of a dispute.
I have either missed something or this could just be a procedural relic from the time when US passport holders were allowed to share ownership of land with their Thai spouses.
As for land is concerned if you can never own it then why sign. The name on the Thai ID card is irrelevant in this case as the land registry will only make the change when both sides have agreed that the funds have been transferred.
The next time this arises I will refuse to sign and see what the outcome is.
I have just been taught an expensive lesson in signing Thai language documents. I made the naive assumption that the agents had read the papers and were only getting me to sign statements that were true. That was not the case and an eagle eyed immigration officer spotted the untruths and under questioning and telling the truth it transpired that I had signed false statements.
With regards land though I cannot see who could gain over a signature for something that the law does not let you own and has no relevance to the wife even in the event of a dispute.
I have either missed something or this could just be a procedural relic from the time when US passport holders were allowed to share ownership of land with their Thai spouses.
[color=blue][size=134]Care in the community success story.[/size][/color]
[quote="buksida
Bit late for me on that one, left my country of origin when I were a whippersnapper[/quote]
Don`t see many of those anymore, do you?
My house is in my Thai step-daughters name, and there was no mention at the land dept. about signing anything, although the estate agent had told me I would have to sign. I guess its a bit like the immigration dept., depends on who you deal with?
Bit late for me on that one, left my country of origin when I were a whippersnapper
[/quote]Don`t see many of those anymore, do you?
My house is in my Thai step-daughters name, and there was no mention at the land dept. about signing anything, although the estate agent had told me I would have to sign. I guess its a bit like the immigration dept., depends on who you deal with?
May you be in heaven half an hour before the devil know`s you`re dead!
That would probably be because, your stepdaughter still keeps her Fathers name?My house is in my Thai step-daughters name, and there was no mention at the land dept. about signing anything, although the estate agent had told me I would have to sign.
I've personally signed a few Chanotes at the land registry. None was ever my money though!
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signing
I have consulted with Lawyers in BKK. I am assured that as long as you are legally married it doesn't matter who's name the land or house or any other property is in, when you divorce all is shared equally.
It doesn't matter that you have signed to say its her money when you buy land, it also doesn't matter if you bought with a company, it doesn't matter if she owns the land and you lease, everything must be shared. So basically, if you divorce then get a good lawyer and get a legal divorce settlement.
My lawyer in BKK charged me 40K for a financial agreement with my wife, which comes into effect if we divorce or seperate for a period of 6 months.
It doesn't matter that you have signed to say its her money when you buy land, it also doesn't matter if you bought with a company, it doesn't matter if she owns the land and you lease, everything must be shared. So basically, if you divorce then get a good lawyer and get a legal divorce settlement.
My lawyer in BKK charged me 40K for a financial agreement with my wife, which comes into effect if we divorce or seperate for a period of 6 months.
Re: signing
Yes, the law is pretty much as you have written. But do not get carried away with the idea that it will automatically be enforced as such. I have an unresolved court case in the "system" that has been, and is, ongoing since my Thai wife passed away nearly 9 years ago. Over 1 million Baht later and all I get told is "soon"! It only takes ONE person to file an objection to any court ruling and you are stuck in the system.samlorsam wrote:I have consulted with Lawyers in BKK. I am assured that as long as you are legally married it doesn't matter who's name the land or house or any other property is in, when you divorce all is shared equally.
May you be in heaven half an hour before the devil know`s you`re dead!
samlorsam, as I said in the other thread, the farang cannot own the land, he will be given a period of time in which to sell his share or transfer the chanote to a Thai.
Nereus, a sad story indeed, definitely a case of "thai rak thai" I think.
Nereus, a sad story indeed, definitely a case of "thai rak thai" I think.
Last edited by buksida on Thu Jun 28, 2007 4:34 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Who is the happier man, he who has braved the storm of life and lived or he who has stayed securely on shore and merely existed? - Hunter S Thompson
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Terry
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Buksi
I know how you feel - it is always up to the individual to sign.
In our case me & Mrs. T were legally married in England, however she has not changed her name here in Thailand.
No problem until the names of our two sons appeared on the 'family book'.
They have my family name.
It was now obvious that she is a miafarang!
So - I now have to go the land office evry time Mrs. T dabbles in land to assure them that I have no interest in it - i.e. sign it away.
So
Don't get a farng name anywhere near the land office or you will be asked to sign - simple eh?
I know how you feel - it is always up to the individual to sign.
In our case me & Mrs. T were legally married in England, however she has not changed her name here in Thailand.
No problem until the names of our two sons appeared on the 'family book'.
They have my family name.
It was now obvious that she is a miafarang!
So - I now have to go the land office evry time Mrs. T dabbles in land to assure them that I have no interest in it - i.e. sign it away.
So
Don't get a farng name anywhere near the land office or you will be asked to sign - simple eh?