Tax residency in Thailand and taxing overseas income

[Troon Expat]

The Thai Examiner makes no reference to the additional 190k bht allowance for those over 65 years of age which would seem appropriate to the elderly Americans example ?

It is my understanding that for a retiree over 65 years of age is entitled to a tax free allowance 190k in addition to the 60k which all tax payers are entitled to. This would be a total 250k which is non assessable income.

Of the assessable income the first 150k is taxed at 0%. So in fact the first 400k is tax free.
Tax thereafter starts a 5% up to a top rate 35% for the various tax bands as widely published.

[kwajdiver]

A big wild card in this proposed new law is what happens if the Thai Department of Revenue decides to interpret a tax treaty differently from how the other signature country interprets it?

For example, if the Thai Revenue Department interprets the U.S. tax treaty differently from how the U.S. interprets it, will the U.S. government challenge the interpretation on behalf of Americans living in Thailand????? Or, will the treaty be nullified????

[PeteC]

I personally don't think it's ever going to happen, at least in the form that we're reading about now. Srettha Thavisin was playing at Finance Minister as well as PM and he pissed off a lot of people as there was no consultation that I'm aware of with the business and various communities who make up the base they will be taxing under his plan. The foreign expat issue is a very minor portion of the package. It's the rich Thais who will suffer and pay the most by far. It could also be part or all of the reason Srettha is now gone, using the excuse of "appointing a former law breaker" to a position.

I think this new group in power will water the program down substantially, and it will be probably years before anything makes its way through parliament and into law.

I would get ready to read volumes upon volumes in the coming year or two regarding changes. That's my 2 satang anyway.

[Big Boy]

I think this new group in power will water the program down substantially, and it will be probably years before anything makes its way through parliament and into law.

I thought in the beginning people were saying it was already law, but never enforced. Or was that the scaremongers having their moment of fame?

[Dan86]

A gree with your take on this. There was a scare piece in ThaiVisa this morning something along the lines of 'OMG It's Happening' and quoting some official. Not sure whther in the article itself or in the comments but the take was basically we are going to tax all foreign income for anyone resident for over 180 days even is that income is not brought into Thailand. Good luck with that lol.

I personally don't think it's ever going to happen, at least in the form that we're reading about now. Srettha Thavisin was playing at Finance Minister as well as PM and he pissed off a lot of people as there was no consultation that I'm aware of with the business and various communities who make up the base they will be taxing under his plan. The foreign expat issue is a very minor portion of the package. It's the rich Thais who will suffer and pay the most by far. It could also be part or all of the reason Srettha is now gone, using the excuse of "appointing a former law breaker" to a position.

I think this new group in power will water the program down substantially, and it will be probably years before anything makes its way through parliament and into law.

I would get ready to read volumes upon volumes in the coming year or two regarding changes. That's my 2 satang anyway.

[STEVE G]

I think this new group in power will water the program down substantially, and it will be probably years before anything makes its way through parliament and into law.

I thought in the beginning people were saying it was already law, but never enforced. Or was that the scaremongers having their moment of fame?

The part about taxing foreign income brought into Thailand is already law, this is the Thai Revenue Departments website and it's covered by sections 40 and 41:
https://www.rd.go.th/english/37749.html

[buksida]

This article seems a bit more balanced, addressing both those who are burying their heads in the sand, thinking it'll all go away, and those in full panic mode ...

Thai tax reform and the Golden Goose
Integrity Legal, an influential network of law firms in USA and Asia, has condemned the proposal of the Thai Revenue Department to tax Thai and foreign residents on their worldwide income irrespective of whether those monies are brought to Thailand. The current regulations (effective January 2024) permit only the taxing of “assessable” income actually transferred from abroad.

In their latest video, the Bangkok-based firm points out that a worldwide policy ruling would strongly deter investment in Thailand, especially as Thai Revenue has no actual jurisdiction to control assets outside the country. If such a radical policy were to be introduced, it would first require a formal change in Thai law, which is by no means a formality.

Meanwhile, Pichai Chunhavajira, the finance minister delivering a keynote address, Shaping Tomorrow, said that current personal and corporate income tax rates remain higher than in competition countries and should be rejigged. He made no mention of the income tax situation for Thai and foreign tax residents. Not a single government spokesperson so far has endorsed, or even commented on, the Revenue’s radical proposal to tax worldwide income, even though first mooted last June.

Social media in Thailand has prophecies that the issuing of annual extensions of stay are about to become dependent on income tax clearance in Thailand. There has been no confirmation from the Cabinet or the immigration bureau. Such a policy would present all manner of problems. For example, many holders of longterm visas, such as Elite, spend less than six months per year in Thailand, whilst notional tourists can easily exploit the new visa exempt rules to clock up more than 180 days in a calendar year. A person’s visa status does not magically show tax liability, or the lack of it.

Thai Revenue, of course, has the role of recommending courses of action to increase national tax income. However, Integrity Legal’s warning that the Golden Goose is in danger of self-assassination illustrates the threat of continuing silence by government ministers or the Cabinet. As many expats threaten to quit living here and the national economy continues to struggle, the need for proper debate is already well overdue.

https://www.pattayamail.com/latestnews/ ... ose-471720

[Dan86]

Just updating this thread with some "information' received directly from Thai Elite within their monnthly email newsletter. This is the text from the email received yesterday (the mentioned attachment was not attached of course, TIT, they sent it to me almost immediately when I pointed this out).

6. Taxation regulations in 2024

Thailand Privilege membership holders are exempt from paying personal income tax in Thailand if they remit funds from a personal bank account abroad into a local bank account in Thailand and can provide proof that the money is not personal income in the same calendar year.

Additionally, if your country has a Double Tax Agreement (DTA) with Thailand, no tax is required in Thailand, even if the income is transferred within the same calendar year it was earned. For further clarification, please refer to the attached summary prepared by the Revenue Department.

The PDF is about 2MB so too large to attach here attached, it raises more questions than it answers IMO - I have uploaded it here: https://drive.proton.me/urls/4RSXAB6VJ8#JDIfuoXiUYWH

[PET]

Just updating this thread with some "information' received directly from Thai Elite within their monnthly email newsletter. This is the text from the email received yesterday (the mentioned attachment was not attached of course, TIT, they sent it to me almost immediately when I pointed this out).

6. Taxation regulations in 2024

Thailand Privilege membership holders are exempt from paying personal income tax in Thailand if they remit funds from a personal bank account abroad into a local bank account in Thailand and can provide proof that the money is not personal income in the same calendar year.

Additionally, if your country has a Double Tax Agreement (DTA) with Thailand, no tax is required in Thailand, even if the income is transferred within the same calendar year it was earned. For further clarification, please refer to the attached summary prepared by the Revenue Department.

The PDF is about 2MB so too large to attach here attached, it raises more questions than it answers IMO - I have uploaded it here: https://drive.proton.me/urls/4RSXAB6VJ8#JDIfuoXiUYWH

IT MIGHT JUST AS WELL HAVE BEEN WRITTEN IN CHINESE !!

[malcolminthemiddle]

Thailand Privilege membership holders are exempt from paying personal income tax in Thailand if they remit funds from a personal bank account abroad into a local bank account in Thailand and can provide proof that the money is not personal income in the same calendar year.

Doesn't that apply to everyone?

[hhinner]

Thailand Privilege membership holders are exempt from paying personal income tax in Thailand if they remit funds from a personal bank account abroad into a local bank account in Thailand and can provide proof that the money is not personal income in the same calendar year.

Doesn't that apply to everyone?

It used to before this year. But now it doesn't matter when the money was earned, it will be taxable (subject to allowances) in the year it's brought into Thailand.

[kwajdiver]

Just updating this thread with some "information' received directly from Thai Elite within their monnthly email newsletter. This is the text from the email received yesterday (the mentioned attachment was not attached of course, TIT, they sent it to me almost immediately when I pointed this out).

6. Taxation regulations in 2024

Thailand Privilege membership holders are exempt from paying personal income tax in Thailand if they remit funds from a personal bank account abroad into a local bank account in Thailand and can provide proof that the money is not personal income in the same calendar year.

Additionally, if your country has a Double Tax Agreement (DTA) with Thailand, no tax is required in Thailand, even if the income is transferred within the same calendar year it was earned. For further clarification, please refer to the attached summary prepared by the Revenue Department.

The PDF is about 2MB so too large to attach here attached, it raises more questions than it answers IMO - I have uploaded it here: https://drive.proton.me/urls/4RSXAB6VJ8#JDIfuoXiUYWH

And I thought U.S. tax laws could be confusing to read…. As I have said before, the nightmare is going to be trying to navigate this bureaucracy……

But, maybe I am wrong and everyone at the revenue department will thoroughly understand this handout all the DTAs that Thailand has, and we will be to get clear, concise and consistent answers…

[404cameljockey]

But, maybe I am wrong and everyone at the revenue department will thoroughly understand this handout all the DTAs that Thailand has, and we will be to get clear, concise and consistent answers…

Irony is my favourite form of humour!

[Hahuahin]

Expats in Thailand should stop worrying about negative income tax
https://www.pattayamail.com/latestnews/ ... tax-476439

On top of current personal income tax woes on funds remitted from overseas, Thailand’s longstay foreigners are now being panicked by premature scares about negative income tax (NIT). Some English-language Thai news sites and social media are warning that NIT is imminent and will require all Thais, as well as foreign residents, to fill in tax forms under penalty early next year and disclose all their worldwide financial resources.

NIT is certainly being considered by sections of the Thai government, but would require a change in the law. Deputy minister of finance Julapun Amornvivat, who is in favour, said recently such a move would require “a few years” to appear formally on the statute book. The reality is that NIT is a framework for taxation and benefits, so you would need to see the details to ascertain the specifics. Nobody has access to any specifics at the present time.

Broadly speaking, NIT targets financial assistance to those with an income below a threshold determined by the government. Those below that threshold receive a cash subsidy on a sliding scale. Advocates of NIT say it will help the elderly, the unemployed and those on marginal incomes. Payments could be made easily via digital platforms such as Paotong and digital wallets. But we have no idea what the cash boundaries might be.

[STEVE G]

I think this article is starting to get to the crux of the matter, basically do you file a tax return next year or not:

Foreign retirees ponder whether to play ball or footsie with the Thai Revenue Department

https://www.pattayamail.com/latestnews/ ... ent-476178


The TRD rule revision – it’s not actually a change in the law – to tax assessable overseas income remitted to Thailand since January 1 2024 continues to baffle many elderly expats. A recent Pattaya poll of 100 retirees and Facebook blogger research suggest that the overwhelming majority have only a faint idea about the implications for them. The typical reaction stated was to carry on regardless with a threat to quit Thailand if the taxman comes knocking.

Of course, not everyone needs to worry. Those Thais or foreigners who spend less than a total of 180 days here in the calendar year 2024 are not deemed to be tax residents. Also exempt are those who are remitting income here which was actually earned in the year 2023, or earlier, as well as those who do not transfer any overseas cash at all in the current calendar year. Those who hold a 10-year Long Term Residence visa are also excused, although some accountants point to the small-print audit which will occur after the first five years completion.

Some expats have signed up with tax lawyers or accountants who offer to act on their behalf. The general advice given so far seems to emphasize that the company will take care, if necessary, when the form filling season is upon us – January to March 2025. One is kinda reminded of the requirement for expats leaving Thailand in the 1980s to get a civil servant to stamp an immigration-required form (the informal fee was 500 baht) which stated that there was no income tax due. Of course, tax affairs are much more sophisticated these days.