Thai navy in line for first submarine fleet

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Thai navy in line for first submarine fleet

Post by PeteC »

We all knew this was coming from previous rumblings in the news, and here it is! The Pattaya-Hua Hin ferry may now have the added attraction of seeing these things during a crossing as I bet they will travel mainly on the surface, if not tied up at the Sattahip base most of the time like the aircraft carrier. Sure to be one stationed in front of the Hua Hin palace as well. Pete :cheers:


Thai navy in line for first subs fleet
PM approves purchase, attacked as vote buying

http://www.bangkokpost.com/news/politic ... subs-fleet

* Published: 28/03/2011 at 12:00 AM
* Newspaper section: News

Prime Minister Abhisit Vejjajiva has approved the Royal Thai Navy's 7.7-billion-baht purchase of six second-hand submarines from Germany for the first-ever missions to protect national interests in the Andaman Sea and the Gulf of Thailand, a navy source says.

The military operation, to be overseen by the navy's new submarine unit, will be carried out in conjunction with training exercises for navy officers who will for the first time be trained in submarine technology and underwater missions with Thai-owned submarines.

Rear Admiral Suriya Pornsuriya has been appointed the first commander of the submarine unit, the source said.

"These submarines will travel at a depth of 30 metres," the source said. "Don't believe rumours they can't run in the Gulf of Thailand because the sea is too shallow. They can work well there."

The six submarines are of the U-206 Class.

They are operated by diesel engines and electric motors and are designed for coastal patrol operations.

The German navy has used them for more than 30 years and is going to decommission them. However, the source said they can still be used for another 10 years.

The Royal Thai Navy decided to buy them after a two-year feasibility study for their use in Thailand. One reason, besides educational and military purposes, is that Thailand has never had a fleet of submarines which makes the Thai navy "outdated", the source said.

A recent meeting between Mr Abhisit, Defence Minister Prawit Wongsuwon and navy commander-in-chief Adm Kamthorn Pumhiran was "satisfactory" as the premier supported the purchase, the source said.

The purchase plan will be forwarded to the cabinet for formal approval in the near future.

It is part of a long-term weapons acquisition scheme granted by the Abhisit government to the army, navy and air force. They are allowed to draft plans to buy weapons over a 10-year period at a total cost of more than 500 billion baht.

"This scheme has been criticised for favouring and awarding soldiers who continually support the government," the source said.

The scheme may also encourage soldiers to support the Democrat Party in the coming general election because all weapon purchase plans will continue under the Democrat-led government, he said.

Surachart Bamrungsuk, a lecturer at Chulalongkorn University's faculty of political science, said he disagreed with the prime minister's plan to purchase the six submarines at a time when the country is facing economic hardship.

He said Thailand had no real need for the submarines.

"I believe [the plan to buy the submarines] is a government populist policy to gain votes from military officers," he said.

Mr Surachart said the cabinet needed to seriously review the navy's purchase plan since the project would involve more money if the submarines' maintenance cost was included.

He said people concerned have long debated the need to have submarines but the issue had never been finalised. The navy has long pushed for the purchase of submarines, reasoning it wanted its personnel to learn about underwater missions.

The Banharn Silpa-archa administration had once sought the acquisition of Swedish Kockums submarines in 1995 but the proposal came under fire for its lack of transparency and was aborted.

Government spokesman Panitan Wattanayagorn said he could not confirm the navy had won the prime minister's support for the purchase plan although he said he was aware the navy had studied the acquisition proposal "for some time".
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Re: Thai navy in line for first submarine fleet

Post by Big Boy »

Who/what is the threat they will defend against? Surely they are buying them for more than just gaining the populist vote :?

What happens in 10 years when they're no longer seaworthy?
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Re: Thai navy in line for first submarine fleet

Post by PeteC »

Big Boy wrote:What happens in 10 years when they're no longer seaworthy?
Painted yellow, big windows installed and available for short rides at Pattaya and Phuket. :wink: Pete :cheers:

EDIT: Seriously though, they'll probably use them to recapture the Preah Viher temple after they deepen the klongs. :shock:
Last edited by PeteC on Mon Mar 28, 2011 4:36 am, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Thai navy in line for first submarine fleet

Post by caller »

Do they have enough resources to man them all? Then there's the cost of the training.....

Seems like madness to me.
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Re: Thai navy in line for first submarine fleet

Post by Jimbob »

The cheap bill will be the scrap price.
The big bill will be the cost of overhaul as they are already at 'end of life' especially if the work is done in Germany. Changes to suit tropical water will be expensive. The Baltic is a bit cooler.
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Re: Thai navy in line for first submarine fleet

Post by Spitfire »

It'll be brave sailors that man those things, 30 year old subs and no experience of subs in the RTN before now. Bet there'll be an accident within a year of them putting to sea.

I'm also a little confused as to what exactly the subs will be defending against in the Gulf of Thailand, maybe a little piracy in the south of it, but not much else.

They had better get on with making hyper accurate sonar maps of the sea floor around Thailand too, but they mentioned they'll be going at 30 meters so might not be so important. :wink:
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Re: Thai navy in line for first submarine fleet

Post by Nereus »

Now now you lot! The little children have to have their toys, or they will grow up bitter and twisted. Besides, just think how many Admirals and Generals kids will be able to have an overseas education, or even a new Porsche car, out of the kickbacks. :tsk:
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Re: Thai navy in line for first submarine fleet

Post by STEVE G »

The navy has long pushed for the purchase of submarines, reasoning it wanted its personnel to learn about underwater missions.
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Re: Thai navy in line for first submarine fleet

Post by Nereus »

Suthep defends purchase of old German U-boats

http://www.bangkokpost.com/news/securit ... an-u-boats

They are 'necessary to guard our territory'

Deputy Prime Minister Suthep Thaugsuban has defended the Royal Thai Navy's 7.7-billion-baht planned procurement of six second-hand submarines, insisting it is necessary for maritime territory protection..................................................

----------------------------------
They have been keeping the lid on this lot: (photo on the link)

Meanwhile, Gen Prawit also joined army chief Prayuth Chan-ocha in taking delivery of three Russian Mi-17V5 helicopters worth 998 million baht at the 11th Infantry Regiment in Bang Khen yesterday.

They and other senior military officers boarded the helicopters for a test flight for 20 minutes.

After the flight, Gen Prawit said the helicopters had proved efficient and cost-effective.

Gen Prayuth has told the Army Aviation Centre to work on the details of a plan to buy three more Mi-17V5 helicopters from Russia, Army Aviation Centre director Phittaya Krachangwong said.

Maj Gen Phittaya said the army needed six of the helicopters but Gen Prayuth suggested the newly acquired helicopters should first be used for six months to see how efficient they are before the army decides if it will buy another three of them.

Maj Gen Phittaya said the Russian-made helicopters may not be on a par with those made in the US, but they are efficient enough and have gained wide recognition. More than 20,000 of them are now in use in some 80 countries, he said.

The idea of buying the Russian-made helicopters was initiated by former army chief and leader of the 2006 coup Sonthi Boonyaratkalin.

The helicopters will be used for logistics and support purposes.

..............................................
I cannot really see the logic in this. A completely new and foreign piece of equipment that they know nothing about. I am sure that they could have got a better deal with some familiar equipment from the USA. I know that these Russian aircraft have been built in vast numbers, but they do not have a very good reputation for reliability and maintenance costs. :?
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Re: Thai navy in line for first submarine fleet

Post by Randy Cornhole »

diy-submarine-close.jpg
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Re: Thai navy in line for first submarine fleet

Post by Spitfire »

The helicopters will be used for logistics and support purposes.
Well, if that's what they are going to be used for, along with the obvious taxi factor for VIPs and generals, then why didn't they just buy a few Hueys made by Bell, lots around and still being used here in Thailand etc, spares a piece of cake to find?

Why bother introducing a new type/make of helicopter and then introducing the maintenance/spares problem that would manifest itself because you have none of them before? Why not just stick with what's easy and already here/available? :?

Obviously it is not a priority to be practical and there must be murky reasons for doing it as it makes no sense, even though this probably wouldn't be a surprise to most. Then again, there are many things that befuddle here. :|
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Re: Thai navy in line for first submarine fleet

Post by Jimbob »

Of course there are affordable submarines to satisfy the Thai navy.
The link is to a home made sub that could be used on the border rivers.
http://englishrussia.com/index.php/2006 ... submarine/
home made sub.jpg
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Re: Thai navy in line for first submarine fleet

Post by Jaime »

I heard that they are going to be used to clear the seafloor of the Gulf of Thailand of khratongs and the corpses of dead tourists that have accumulated there in recent years....
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Re: Thai navy in line for first submarine fleet

Post by sandman67 »

so obviously ignoring the totally correct and sage words of His Majesty who asked why Thailand needs submarines as it has no real enemies, especially ones with a significant war fleet, and how they intend operating covertly in a gulf so shallow you can almost touch the bottom in most places thus rendering said subs totally ineffective.

Its about time the LOS sent the whole pack of shabby useless shiny arsed tinpot generals who plague this country packing IMHO, as none of them seem to own a frickin calendar and know this is 2010 not 1945. As per usual, while the west decomissions its sub fleets as expensive geegaws that are useless toys, La La Land does the exact opposite and buys said decomissioned deathtraps to fight its imaginary cold war with two mostly landlocked countries on either side.

If you want to know why theres any conflicts on the borders just look for a cocknocker in green with a pack of bottletops on his chest... hes looking to increase his collection of tit warmerswhilst raking in the kickbacks.

Of course, the other advantage of these miltary bunfest spending fees it it diverts money away from education and health, thus keeping the Thai populace unhealthy and stupid therefore pliable and compliant with this insanity

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Re: Thai navy in line for first submarine fleet

Post by PeteC »

Someone must have left a hatch open as things are sinking. Pete :cheers:

NAVY
Plan to buy old U-boats sparks signs of conflict

http://www.bangkokpost.com/news/local/2 ... f-conflict

* Published: 28/04/2011 at 12:00 AM
* Newspaper section: News

Signs of conflict have emerged over the navy's 7.7-billion-baht plan to procure second-hand German submarines as a top aide to the defence minister has insisted the procurement plan has yet to be approved.

"The Defence Council didn't approve the submarine purchase, only acknowledged it," Noppadon Inthapanya, secretary to Defence Minister Prawit Wongsuwon, said yesterday.

On Monday, navy commander Kamthorn Phumhiran spent almost two hours outlining the plan to buy six second-hand U-206 A submarines worth 7.7 billion baht to the Defence Council.

Council spokesman Col Thanatip Sawangsaeng said at that time council members, who include the defence permanent secretary and supreme commander, were satisfied with the procurement plan.

Gen Noppadon said yesterday with only one cabinet meeting left before a House dissolution, the procurement is unlikely to be approved by the current administration.

"I think it will be quite difficult for the defence minister to bring the matter before the cabinet meeting next week [May 3]," he said.

Gen Prawit left for China yesterday on a visit scheduled to last until Saturday. He will reportedly also look at Chinese submarines.

Earlier Gen Prawit raised the idea of buying South Korean-made submarines as an alternative for the navy because they are new.

Gen Noppadon, however, denied speculation that the defence minister wanted to buy submarines from South Korea, saying weapons procurement would be at the request of each force.

He said there were several steps involved in any weapons purchase plans so it was impossible to say the submarine scheme would be approved by the cabinet before the House is dissolved. Such plans have to be screened by the Royal Thai Armed Forces Headquarters, the Office of the Permanent Secretary and the Budget Bureau, among others.

Gen Noppadon said the consideration process may take time, but that is to ensure transparency and accountability.

"I, on behalf of the defence minister's secretary, can't allow any matter where doubts remain over transparency to be passed on.

"What we have to consider is whether the navy needs the submarines, how much budget is available, and decide if new or old ones should be procured," he said.

He said if the submarine scheme is approved, he would be responsible for answering questions from the media.

The submarine procurement matter has yet to arrive at the office of defence minister, he said.

Meanwhile, a highly placed source at the Defence Ministry said yesterday the submarine plan has been considered by the Royal Thai Armed Forces Headquarters and the Office of the Permanent Secretary.
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