Pension Rights for British expats

[sargeant]

I have read this drummond article a few times now

It just happens that yesterday i recieved confirmation of my state pension plus bumf 116.15 pounds per week

Queston 1 is i am sure the recipricol agreement between Thailand and the UK was in existance and i believe was rescinded under gordon brown please advise if am wrong

in 1998 A person aged 65 years could recieve a retirement visa for 400,000Bt income per annum @ 72Bt per pound 5,555 pounds a year
If only on a state pension@ that time he would have needed a state pension of 106 pounds per week (in my bumf now 15 years on the maximum state pension as of yesterday 107.45 pounds per week even with maximum SERPS 74.30 pounds a week and graduated pension of 5.38 pounds a week total 187.13 per week) drummonds article suggests that it was a lot less 15 years ago as it has had no nil increases @ a guess lets put a figure of 50 quid less 137.13 pounds a week in 1998

When the retirement figure was raised to 800,000Bt a year those on 400,000Bt were grandfathered in on the previous rules and as far as i know still are
however the rate of exchange has noticably dropped and @48Bt to the pound a grandfathered in pensioner would now need @48Bt to the pound 8,333 pounds a year or a penson of 160.25 pounds a week

But if he is still on 5,555 quid a year @48Bt 266,640 Bt he does not qualify for a retirement visa even under the old rules

May i suggest he is no where near worse of than the poorest of thais and if this is his max income then he is an illegal

Lomu i agree 1,000%

What a load of general tripe.
People make bad decisions about their lives all over the world

Finally i will type directly what it says on my bumf so people do not listen to one uninformed smartarse poster on his site

If you do not get the increase while you are abroad you may get the higher ammount of benefit if you visit the UK or a country that applies the European Community regulations or a reciprical agreement country, except Bermuda and the USA. The lower ammount will again be paid when you leave.



AND the no increase rule is still bluddy wrong wrong wrong

[Dannie Boy]

Isn't it ironic that those of us living outside the UK and therefore no burden whatsoever on the state are penalised in this way. What they should be doing is rather than annual increases, give all of us a 50% bonus on top of the normal pension for foregoing any NHS or other state benefit we would be entitled to if we back in the UK.

Of course the chance of that happening are diddly squat, but it's nice to fantasise!!

[sargeant]

Isn't it ironic that those of us living outside the UK and therefore no burden whatsoever on the state are penalised in this way.

Dannie Boy its far worse than that i am definitely no burden

I am refused the increases like i am a piece of crud on their shoes, but they even expect me to PAY BLUDDY TAX to the SOBs on my private pension and now on both

I want some explanation as to why i am paying tax for increases to other peoples state pensions but do not get it myself

1.- I paid in the exact same way as those that get the rises
2.- It was a compulsory payment and it is discrimination at its worst
3.- I pay Tax used to fund the NHS but cant use it

I also want to know why i should pay taxes at all if i am not recieving any benefit from it let alone be discriminated against

[Dannie Boy]

Isn't it ironic that those of us living outside the UK and therefore no burden whatsoever on the state are penalised in this way.

Dannie Boy its far worse than that i am definitely no burden

I am refused the increases like i am a piece of crud on their shoes, but they even expect me to PAY BLUDDY TAX to the SOBs on my private pension and now on both

I want some explanation as to why i am paying tax for increases to other peoples state pensions but do not get it myself

1.- I paid in the exact same way as those that get the rises
2.- It was a compulsory payment and it is discrimination at its worst
3.- I pay Tax used to fund the NHS but cant use it

I also want to know why i should pay taxes at all if i am not recieving any benefit from it let alone be discriminated against

Yes Sarge, you, me and countless 100,000's (if not millions) of us all over the world are doing the same. We can all see that it is discrimination at its worst and yet successive governments (both of the leading parties are as bad as each other here) turn a blind eye to it and stick 2 fingers up, but how the hell do we go about getting it corrected?

[blue05]

Isn't it ironic that those of us living outside the UK and therefore no burden whatsoever on the state are penalised in this way.

Dannie Boy its far worse than that i am definitely no burden

I am refused the increases like i am a piece of crud on their shoes, but they even expect me to PAY BLUDDY TAX to the SOBs on my private pension and now on both

I want some explanation as to why i am paying tax for increases to other peoples state pensions but do not get it myself

1.- I paid in the exact same way as those that get the rises
2.- It was a compulsory payment and it is discrimination at its worst
3.- I pay Tax used to fund the NHS but cant use it

I also want to know why i should pay taxes at all if i am not recieving any benefit from it let alone be discriminated against

Yes Sarge, you, me and countless 100,000's (if not millions) of us all over the world are doing the same. We can all see that it is discrimination at its worst and yet successive governments (both of the leading parties are as bad as each other here) turn a blind eye to it and stick 2 fingers up, but how the hell do we go about getting it corrected?

This does not affect me and I have seen similar posts all over Thailand, with no real concensus.

The government has to put it before parliament if there are 100,000 digital signatures on one of their petitions. Whynot start one? It only takes one signature to start. I am sure you woukd get 1000's of expats signing up pretty quickly

[sargeant]

What was ironic was that it was only yesterday when the postman arrived with my bumf and stuff

so i have all the docs and info at hand

Here are the countries with recipricol agreements where you get the raises

Barbados Bermuda , Bosnia herzogovina ,Croatia ,Guernsey ,Isreal ,Jamaica, Jersey, Mauritius, Philipines
The former Yugoslav republic of Macedonia (holy crap)
The state Union of Serbia and montenegro ( i am not making this up)
Turkey and the United states of America

I wonder why the two in red get special treatment
How many brits do you reckon get it in any of the others in blue

[sargeant]

I dont know blue05 but maybe its because the govts of both parties have said bog off and that is why it has gone to the european high court
just an of the cuff guess

[Dannie Boy]

I dont know blue05 but maybe its because the govts of both parties have said bog off and that is why it has gone to the european high court
just an of the cuff guess

Sorry to show my ignorance, but can anybody advise how you set up an electronic petition to seek the 100,000 digital signatures required?

[Big Boy]

http://www.direct.gov.uk/en/Diol1/DoItOnline/DG_066327

[Dannie Boy]

http://www.direct.gov.uk/en/Diol1/DoItOnline/DG_066327

great suggestion BB although I hit the link and then did a search on pensions for those living outside the UK and found the following:

Responsible department: Department for Work and Pensions


The freezing of the UK State Pension paid to Ex UK Residents living abroad, should be continued. These individuals are obviously wealthy enough to live outside the UK and do not contribute to the UK either through Taxes (in the form of personal taxation, VAT etc) or in being a Consumer and contributing to the UK economy whether it is to the Public Sector (the NHS for example) or the private sector (goods and services), by living in the UK. A rise to these individual's State Pension should not be awarded beyond which it was payable at, when they left the UK, which is the current rule, unless there is a "Reciprocal Agreement" in the Country where they have gone to to live. It is debateable in the current economic state of the UK if these Reciprocal Agreements should stand

Fortunately, nobody has signed in support, but its amazing how some people view this subject!!!

[blue05]

I dont know blue05 but maybe its because the govts of both parties have said bog off and that is why it has gone to the european high court
just an of the cuff guess

Obviously a well informed guess, so if you are so well informed why bother asking on a forum. Or at least let people know where its at in the eu court

[Dannie Boy]

http://www.direct.gov.uk/en/Diol1/DoItOnline/DG_066327

great suggestion BB although I hit the link and then did a search on pensions for those living outside the UK and found the following:

Responsible department: Department for Work and Pensions


The freezing of the UK State Pension paid to Ex UK Residents living abroad, should be continued. These individuals are obviously wealthy enough to live outside the UK and do not contribute to the UK either through Taxes (in the form of personal taxation, VAT etc) or in being a Consumer and contributing to the UK economy whether it is to the Public Sector (the NHS for example) or the private sector (goods and services), by living in the UK. A rise to these individual's State Pension should not be awarded beyond which it was payable at, when they left the UK, which is the current rule, unless there is a "Reciprocal Agreement" in the Country where they have gone to to live. It is debateable in the current economic state of the UK if these Reciprocal Agreements should stand

Fortunately, nobody has signed in support, but its amazing how some people view this subject!!!

I have now created a new petition, but it takes up to a week to be checked to ensure that it complies with the websites T&C's - I will post an update once I receive a response from them

[margaretcarnes]

Sarge - I also totally disagree with this stupid rule. But I've worked with Benefits on and off since 1992 and as far as I recall the freeze which applies to Brits in Thailand - and in many other countries - has been in place forever.
I'm also unaware of a situation where people returning to the UK or a reciprocal country - then going back to the LOS - would be knocked back to square one. What happens if people go back 'home' is that their pension increases begin again, but only based on the level they were on when leaving the LOS. If they return to the LOS later the pension increases freeze again. There may well be some kind of linking rule involved whereby they have to spend so long out of the LOS for increases to begin again. Thinking back to the case of the British woman who achieved pension increase rights because she lives 50/50 6 months each per year in the UK and NZ, I would guess any time limit is 6 months.
I will check all this for you. Meawhile remember that your tax free allowance will increase to £10,500 at 65. That higher allowance should be effective from this April, so you should get any refund due some time next year.

[sargeant]

Blue 05 it WAS a guess i read it in the drummond article about the EU court and presumed the rest which hardly denotes well informed hence why i asked

Dannie Boy

and do not contribute to the UK either through Taxes (in the form of personal taxation,

Is that a quote from them if so give me an email address because that is total B******s i have paid tax ever since i came here and still am and will pay even more in spite of the 10500 tax code

I am refused the increases like i am a piece of crud on their shoes, but they even expect me to PAY BLUDDY TAX to the SOBs on my private pension and now on both

I want some explanation as to why i am paying tax for increases to other peoples state pensions but do not get it myself

Mags i have typed exactely what it says on the bumf i have recieved

If you do not get the increase while you are abroad you may get the higher ammount of benefit if you visit the UK or a country that applies the European Community regulations or a reciprical agreement country, except Bermuda and the USA. The lower ammount will again be paid when you leave.

i think the large letters are pretty clear although how they would know one is back in Thailand other than the embassy informing them when you need an income letter for your visa i dont know

[Dannie Boy]

Blue 05 it WAS a guess i read it in the drummond article about the EU court and presumed the rest which hardly denotes well informed hence why i asked

Dannie Boy

and do not contribute to the UK either through Taxes (in the form of personal taxation,

Is that a quote from them if so give me an email address because that is total B******s i have paid tax ever since i came here and still am and will pay even more in spite of the 10500 tax code

I am refused the increases like i am a piece of crud on their shoes, but they even expect me to PAY BLUDDY TAX to the SOBs on my private pension and now on both

I want some explanation as to why i am paying tax for increases to other peoples state pensions but do not get it myself

Mags i have typed exactely what it says on the bumf i have recieved

If you do not get the increase while you are abroad you may get the higher ammount of benefit if you visit the UK or a country that applies the European Community regulations or a reciprical agreement country, except Bermuda and the USA. The lower ammount will again be paid when you leave.

i think the large letters are pretty clear although how they would know one is back in Thailand other than the embassy informing them when you need an income letter for your visa i dont know

Sarge, there is no email address, the extract I quoted was from somebody who had posted a petition stating the very opposite to what we think is just - as we know, anybody who receives a UK pension (state and/or private) that exceeds the tax free allowance will pay UK tax.