Electric Vehicles (EV) Thread

[pharvey]

Watching Sky News at the moment and just now there was a report about EVs. It seems that over 40% of all public charging points are in London and the South-East. It went on to show the horrendous queues at charging points on some motorways over the holiday period.

That's the whole issue. The reason many in London have EV's is due to the "Emission Charges" - pay a fortune for an EV, pay a fortune for the (daily) Emission Charges or take the completely unreliable (and expensive) public transport? Still, the infrastructure for EV's is not there!

Bristol is set to follow, with a £9 daily charge on (higher) emissions - even for those living there!! My sister has an older car and now is going to get hit with a +/- £3 K per year "Tax" just to be able to drive to work (she's a carer, so can hardly take public transport).

The UK is in a mess with the whole issue, but we're certainly not alone.

[Dannie Boy]

Toyota Hilux Revo BEV preview:
https://www.vanguardngr.com/2022/12/toy ... -revo-bev/

Oh good God no!! It's "Grandfather" will be turning in it's grave (if it ever died)!!

To explain the latter comment, when working at NFC Rayong in 1997, I was provided with a Toyota Hilux for the duration (18 months or so). I and others I met during my stay tried our best to "kill" it (dreadful site conditions, hard driving etc.), but failed in the extreme - a true beast of a machine.

This "EV version" wouldn't come close IMO - and is an ugly wench to say the least!

I believe that the Top Gear rogues did the same and met with the same result - indestructible!!

[pharvey]

I believe that the Top Gear rogues did the same and met with the same result - indestructible!!

They did indeed - and to be honest, I believe every part, even the drop from a high story building!!

[STEVE G]

Toyota Hilux Revo BEV preview:
https://www.vanguardngr.com/2022/12/toy ... -revo-bev/

Oh good God no!! It's "Grandfather" will be turning in it's grave (if it ever died)!!

To explain the latter comment, when working at NFC Rayong in 1997, I was provided with a Toyota Hilux for the duration (18 months or so). I and others I met during my stay tried our best to "kill" it (dreadful site conditions, hard driving etc.), but failed in the extreme - a true beast of a machine.

This "EV version" wouldn't come close IMO - and is an ugly wench to say the least!

Where I am in Europe, a large amount of new light delivery vehicles are now electric so the economics obviously work.
I think new fleet van orders in the UK are something like 60% electric. It's the same with taxis, the majority of them here are now electric or plug in hybrids.

[migrant]

5 hidden costs in electric vehicles.

https://www.aol.com/finance/5-hidden-co ... 48245.html

[STEVE G]

5 hidden costs in electric vehicles.

https://www.aol.com/finance/5-hidden-co ... 48245.html

One of the five hidden costs in that article is the fact that maintenance savings are only 300 dollars a year!
Anyway, if cheap driving is the only object, why are the roads filled with large black BMWs and Mercedes?

[KhunLA]

Another anti EV opinion piece that doesn't relate to TH;

EVs Still Cost Much More To Buy
... about the same price as ICE, especially with govt incentives


Most Drivers Will Change Cars Before an EV Pays Off
... redundant & irrelevant if you trade your car in ever few years. Although our BEV is worth more today than when we bought it.

Electricity Is Cheaper Than Gas, But It’s Hardly Free
... TH electric is inexpensive, and if having solar, inexpensive in TH, then basically free. We charge the car with excess solar at the house.

The Myth of a Maintenance-Free Vehicle
... only an idiot believes it's maintenance free. But no oil changes, no tune ups, no exhaust system to wear out. That's a lot of money saved.

EVs Are More Expensive To Repair and Insure
... all higher end cars with better components are. The motors & battery pack, can last decades, if taken care of properly. Same as any vehicle.

[Dannie Boy]

Another anti EV opinion piece that doesn't relate to TH;

EVs Still Cost Much More To Buy
... about the same price as ICE, especially with govt incentives


Most Drivers Will Change Cars Before an EV Pays Off
... redundant & irrelevant if you trade your car in ever few years. Although our BEV is worth more today than when we bought it.

Electricity Is Cheaper Than Gas, But It’s Hardly Free
... TH electric is inexpensive, and if having solar, inexpensive in TH, then basically free. We charge the car with excess solar at the house.

The Myth of a Maintenance-Free Vehicle
... only an idiot believes it's maintenance free. But no oil changes, no tune ups, no exhaust system to wear out. That's a lot of money saved.

EVs Are More Expensive To Repair and Insure
... all higher end cars with better components are. The motors & battery pack, can last decades, if taken care of properly. Same as any vehicle.

The only point I’d question is the last one - there is little evidence so far that battery packs last decades - they might indeed, but there aren’t enough EV cars older than 10 years to substantiate that part of the claim - everything else is probably correct.

[STEVE G]

When I read these anti-EV articles and posts, I'm somewhat reminded of those 18th century French peasants who attacked an early balloon flight with pitchforks, if people don't want an electric car, they can simply not buy one.
I don't really understand this constant need to try and stop other people from buying them.
It's not working anyway, 39% of vehicles sold in Germany in November were either fully electric or PHEVs which is rather a lot of something that we're constantly being told is an impossibility.

[Dannie Boy]

Quite a few of the comments are not exactly anti-EV, more a case of pointing out that they’re not the great saviour than many purported to - over the last year in particular, the increase in the charge of electricity largely cancels out the savings over petrol/diesel. The life-time environmental impact is questionable, but almost certainly not the big environmental improvement that many claim. The capital cost (in most countries) is still quite @ bit more than ICE vehicles. Question marks remain over battery technology/range. You can’t ignore the concerns over how/where some of the rare materials come from and the possible/probable exploration of the labour force. And last, but by no means least, there’s the question of the charging infrastructure - in most countries it’s woefully insufficient.

I’ve said before a number of times, I drive a PHEV and thoroughly enjoy the driving experience when in EV mode, I just hope that the technology brings about suitable and sustainable battery technology to allow for mass adoption.

[sateeb]

/\ Spot on Steve G.
Although I would call myself an old petrol head I've convinced myself that my next car will be some form of electric/hybrid (if I live that long).
NB . the dinosaurs were eventually wiped out

[GroveHillWanderer]

The only point I’d question is the last one - there is little evidence so far that battery packs last decades - they might indeed, but there aren’t enough EV cars older than 10 years to substantiate that part of the claim - everything else is probably correct.

There is evidence from testing carried out on EV batteries.

It isn't the case that the only way to have evidence of how long a battery will last is to just give it to a normal driver who will use it in a normal fashion, and then wait for a couple of decades to see what happens.

EV batteries (like many consumer goods) undergo testing to simulate use but in an accelerated fashion, so they can see within a relatively short period of time, how long the product would last under normal, real-world conditions.

In the case of Tesla batteries, according to the article below, the company says their batteries will last through enough recharge cycles to drive some 300,000 to 500,000 miles, which is equivalent to 22-37 years use for an average motorist, according to figures from the US Dept of Transportation.

In fact there's some evidence that the batteries could last even longer than that. For instance, the same article mentions that, without having to change the battery:

One Tesla owner has reportedly driven his Tesla Model S over a million miles.

https://news.energysage.com/how-long-do ... ries-last/

The second article below talks EV batteries in general and gives a shorter average life span than Tesla's but still points out that:

... research shows that electric car batteries will probably outlive the vehicle they’re in (and even then, they can have a second life).

https://blog.evbox.com/ev-battery-longevity

[GroveHillWanderer]

An electric KIA with super car performance:
https://www.topgear.com/car-reviews/kia ... irst-drive

£61595 only does 252 miles impractical before you search for a place to charge it then wait for hours for it to charge. Why do you want super car, performance nearly all roads have speed limits far below speed a super can do.

What makes you think it takes hours to charge? According to the specs on the link below, the KIA EV6 GT can charge from 10-80% in 16 minutes.

https://evbox.com/en/electric-cars/kia/kia-ev6

Perhaps you were looking at the AC charging figures which are in the hours, but that's basically for home charging. Fast, commercial chargers use DC, not AC.

[Dannie Boy]

An electric KIA with super car performance:
https://www.topgear.com/car-reviews/kia ... irst-drive

£61595 only does 252 miles impractical before you search for a place to charge it then wait for hours for it to charge. Why do you want super car, performance nearly all roads have speed limits far below speed a super can do.

What makes you think it takes hours to charge? According to the specs on the link below, the KIA EV6 GT can charge from 10-80% in 16 minutes.

https://evbox.com/en/electric-cars/kia/kia-ev6

Perhaps you were looking at the AC charging figures which are in the hours, but that's basically for home charging. Fast, commercial chargers use DC, not AC.

The original article (or one that I read) said that drivers had to queue to get to chargers hence waiting hours - not necessarily that it takes hours to charge a car, although even the figures you quote for the EV6 are optimal figures using a fast charger - not necessarily widely available or in working condition judging by many reports!!

[handdrummer]

EVs are like everything else that's for sale; if you want one, buy one, if you don't, don't.
I don't understand why some people try to talk other people out of buying something.
It's not your money, it's not your life. Why do you care?